Crème Connection, Part 5

Crème Connection, Part 5

The Crème supporter makes this comment (Sept 26, 2003) “If you can’t watch it live on TV right now, watch the democratic debate tonight at 9pm EST. on MSNBC. This is not just about politics, it’s about everything that politics effects, which is everything on earth. I suggest you pay attention to the Congressman from Ohio, Dennis Kucinich. Whether you want to believe it, he is the highest hope for the betterment of the American future.”

Check out what he says: ”I live each day with a grateful heart and a desire to be of service to humanity”, is what he says. I know most of you couldn’t care less what Benjamin Créme has said, but hear me out – Créme has said that the Hierarchy supports Kucinich, that Kucinich is the only presidential candidate who is receptive to the mental impressions from the Hierarchy. Créme has also said if Kucinich gets on the bill as the Democratic presidential candidate, he will become President. Obviously the choice is yours who you want to support – the Masters know who They support. Watch the debates tonight!

JJ: You just can’t resist getting us back into politics. I must admit though that it is interesting to know that this is a Crème endorsed candidate. This makes it interesting to examine him.

I can tell you this right now – and this is based on pure common sense – Kucinich does not have a chance in hell of getting the nomination let alone the presidency. This will be just one more example of a failed prediction of Benjamin Crème.

Two weeks ago Kucinich was last in the polls (USA Today) with 2%. Now he is below last with 1%.

Part of the reason for his bad showing may be his terrible hairpiece. I notice that every candidate that looks like he is wearing a rug never seems to go far.

Why is he in last place? One reason is he is so far left that he makes Howard Dean look like Ronald Reagan. I can see why Créme likes him though. Kucinich is for the forced redistribution of wealth with a philosophy in harmony with Crème.

The reader and Crème maintain that Kucinich has the support of the Hierarchy.

Let us pick one of his views that DK has commented on and see how it stands up.

Kucinich strongly opposes nuclear power plants for the generation of power.

Here is what DK said on the matter:

Concerning atomic energy he said the following around 1945: “As the forerunner of that release of energy which will change the mode of human living and inaugurate the new age wherein we shall not have civilizations and their emerging cultures but a world culture and an emerging civilization, thus demonstrating the true synthesis which underlies humanity. The atomic bomb emerged from a first ray Ashram, working in conjunction with a fifth ray group; from the long range point of view, its intent was and is purely beneficent.” Externalization of the Hierarchy, Pages 547-548

“On the physical plane, the great scientific discovery, called colloquially the “splitting of the atom,” will be turned eventually to the production of those conditions which will enable mankind to follow the good, the beautiful and the true. This men will then be able to do, freed from the dread presence of purely materialistic thinking. This is no idle vision or vague dream. Many scientists today (and particularly those who love their fellowmen) are not only visioning the non-destructive aspect of atomic energy but are already engaged in harnessing-for the good of humanity-some of its products and its radioactive properties.” Rays & Initiations, Pg 648

This “splitting of the atom” that will produce so much good is the process used in nuclear reactors which generate the power for us that Kucinich is so strongly against.

Why then would the Hierarchy support a man who is so against such an important part of the plan of the Hierarchy?

Now, we might ask this question. Who is fighting tooth and nail to do more research into nuclear power and seeks to build more pollution free power plants?

None other than George Bush.

Who then is the likely one to be endorsed by the Hierarchy? The one who is fighting the plan or the one who seeks to further the plan?

The answer is. Of course, the one who seeks to further the plan.

This is one of the few political issues that DK has commented on. I think DK sought to avoid being too political but throughout his writings he did support one important principle by which we can judge many politicians and that is the principle of freedom. He stressed this principle and stated numerous times that it is worth fighting for. He supported the war against Germany and Japan along with the destruction of their tyrannical system and being replaced with a free society.

Would not DK take the same stand today in a similar situation where the tyrannies of the world today?

There is no reason to think otherwise.

It is interesting that you point out two people who Crème admires who seem to be miles away from the Plan discussed by DK. First Sai Baba, a guru of whom there is mountains of evidence that he sexually abuses little boys and uses magic tricks to con followers and now Kucinich who seems to have little in common with the Hierarchy except maybe a vegetarian diet. This means little, however, when you consider that Hitler was a vegetarian.

The Crème acolyte was gracious enough to respond to the above saying, “A 9 year old could tell you that Kucinich is a super long shot of getting the Democratic nomination. It also was not a “prediction of Benjamin Crème”, Créme was just stating that Kucinich is the highest hope out of those running for President.”

JJ: Certainly sounded like a prediction to me. Here are your actual words : “Créme has also said if Kucinich gets on the bill as the Democratic presidential candidate, he WILL become President.”

This was a definite prediction, but with condition of getting “on the bill” whatever that means. This way if he became president he could say he was right, but if not he could say he never made it to the bill.

Let me just give a prediction much easier to understand. Kucinich will not get the nomination nor will he come close to the presidency in 2004.

Reader: Labeling Kucinich as “far left” is just another convenient way to break down the humanity of this man. Wake up and seal the door where you maintain the audacity of judgment and the limitation of ideology.

JJ: This is not just some random label. I would bet that Kucinich himself would admit that he is on the far left. Sometimes far left or far right is good depending on where the pendulum is. This was not said as an attack, but merely as an accurate description of where Kucinich is at the present.

For instance, Kucinich (by his own words is for) (1) Universal health care (2) Abolishing the death penalty (3) More welfare programs (4) Believes in big government and wants it to be bigger (5) Anti war in almost every circumstance. (6) Pro abortion (7) Consistently agrees with Greenpeace and the Sierra Club (8) Loves Ralph Nader

I could go on. Several points like this would just put him on the left, but consistent harmony with the many points makes him far left. Simple enough?

If you think that being on the far left “breaks down his humanity” it really makes me wonder why you are on the far left in your positions. Do you also feel like you have lost your humanity? Let us hope not.

Reader: Kucinich nor Créme are for this so-called “forced” redistribution of wealth, they do support the divine quality of sharing – but it’s a shame that you have to add “forced” to suit your conditioned mind about these two men.

JJ: I’ve read a number of Kucinich’s social “sharing” proposals and they call a “forced” taking from those who have and giving it to the have nots. For instance:

(1) Increasing welfare (2) Increasing funding for Medicare (3) Preventing the individual from using his social security to invest himself, even on a small scale. Seems to think the government an do better with our money than we can (4) Supports tax increases (5) Supports universal health care

According to the Liberty Index Kucinich is the opposite of a Libertarian.

“Congressman Dennis Kucinich received one of the lowest ratings (30) for personal liberties and received a perfectly awful zero for his stand on economic liberties. His overall score of 15 on 40 key votes earned him a rating of Authoritarian. In fact, Kucinich rated near the bottom of the 435 congressmen rated in the study. According to Professor Thies, an Authoritarian, like Kucinich, believes in a strong state apparatus intervening extensively in economic and personal affairs.”

Another point I found interesting is that Kucinich is eager for the taxpayer to give his money to support his causes yet his tax returns reveal that he deducted absolutely nothing for charitable donations.

On the other hand, Bush’s tax returns show he gave about 12% of his income to charities.

Who has the earned authority in preaching to us about sharing? The one who gives nothing or the one who already shares more than a tithe of his income?

Reader: Humanity has two choices – share or die. It’s that simple. Both Créme and Kucinich realize this and it is also evident to the Hierarchy.

JJ: The free world already does a lot of sharing with the United States in the lead. I support this as long it is done through free will and not forced by an agency such as the U.N.

Bush is asking for $87 billion much of which is to “share” with Iraq in its rebuilding and stabilization. Kucinich is fighting against this sharing – a sharing which may actually do something worthwhile.

If Crème is (or has been) a member of the Communist party then he believes in forced equality. Kucinich views appear to head this direction.

Some of Kucinich’s views are OK in my view. He supports human rights, with which most sensitive people agree.

One good thing about him is that his initials are DK. I guess he can’t be all bad.

Reader: Today, humanity does not fairly share all of the world’s resources, and this is creating an imbalance so inharmonious with the qualities of the soul that humanity will, through nuclear war because of separatism and greed, destroy all life on this planet.

JJ: It’s a myth that the forced sharing of resources will produce abundance. After World War II Japan was left with almost zero resources. They are a country with very few natural resources. All they had was their will and a free market plan presented to them by Edwards Deming from the United States. Using the “teach a man to fish” principle they became a great economic power without the forced sharing of resources from other nations.

The city of Shanghai is another example. This city has close to zero in natural resources, but when the free market, natural intelligence and hard work were allowed to do their work they became one of the wealthiest cities in the world.

By contrast some of the poorest nations are the wealthiest in natural resources. Both Africa, South America and Russia have tremendous natural resources. To develop them they do not need a sharing of resources for they already have resources. What they need is freedom and a sharing of intelligence to use that which they already have.

Reader: You quote DK, but before you even quote Him you state the quotes are about “atomic energy” – how naive and vain to not allow the reader to determine what DK is talking about, instead, you already condition their thought by your assumption.

Well, JJ, i have a quote on “atomic energy” also – “Let me see if I can make my meaning clear. The stage of atomic energy is largely that which concerns the material side of life, and corresponds to the childhood period in the life of a man or a race. It is the time of realism, of intense activity, of development by action above all else, or pure self-centeredness and self-interest. It produces the materialistic point of view, and leads inevitably to selfishness. It involves the recognition of the atom as being entirely self-contained, and similarly of the human units as having a separate life apart from all other units, and with no relationship to others. Such a stage can be seen in the little evolved races of the world, in small children, and in those who are little developed. They are normally self-centered; their energies are concerned with their own life; they are occupied with the objective and with that which is tangible; they are characterized by a necessary and protective selfishness.” – The Consciousness of the Atom, Pages 24-25

JJ: You are not quoting DK here, but a book written by Alice A. Bailey, and what’s more she wrote it in 1922, long before the development of atomic energy by fission or fusion, of which Bailey and the world at large at that time knew little or nothing. It is also important to note that DK sometimes complained that Alice A. Bailey lacked scientific knowledge.

Bailey here was not talking about atomic energy as is used today. If you read her book you will find that she calls a human being an atom or atomic unit, and his movement, discrimination and choices produce what she called “atomic energy.” This atomic energy concerns the individual unit and eventually evolves into group energy or group work.

This treatise has absolutely nothing to do with the atomic bomb, fission or nuclear power plants.

Reader: Hopefully you’re aware that the quote is certainly out of context, but it does make me smirk when contrasted to your “atomic energy” quotes.

JJ You can take the smirk off your face now the truth is revealed. Perhaps “red with embarrassment” might be closer to the mark now.

Reader: i am aware of your immense support of nuclear energy. The problem with your “rational” claims about it being safe are from results based on the naive and erroneous “facts” of today’s materialistic science.

JJ: My facts are solid and are in the archives for all to examine. I challenge you to find any error in them.

Reader: Here is a quote from DK to ponder, “I would remind you that the release of atomic energy has had a far more potent effect in the etheric web than in the dense physical vehicle of the planet. Three times the atomic bomb was used, and that fact is itself significant. It was used twice in Japan, thereby disrupting the etheric web in what you erroneously call the Far East; it was used once in what is also universally called the Far West, and each time a great area of disruption was formed which will have future potent, and at present unsuspected, results.” – DINA 2

Did a light bulb go on in your mind just now? Hopefully it did.

JJ: Dream on, my friend. Again you are referencing a quote that has nothing to do with the argument. Here DK was talking about the atomic bomb. In his writings he differentiated between the bomb and the use of atomic energy for the peaceful production of power.

Even so, he supported the dropping of the atomic bomb on Japan to end the war and the possession of this power in the hands of the free nations as a “saving force.” He was certainly against the use of the bomb except as a “saving force.”

I agree 100% with him. I have even written up a plan that could eventually eliminate nuclear weapons from the earth – called Project Peace and Goodwill. Being anti nuclear bomb is a much different thing than anti nuclear energy.

The trouble is that many people with little knowledge of nuclear energy do not differentiate between the two and have a knee jerk reaction against nuclear energy with the same repulsion as they would have toward a nuclear bomb.

Reader: I have read your zealous essay/10 part article on your views concerning nuclear energy and it’s mostly sound when today’s limited science shines light on it – but when esoteric knowledge shines it’s more inclusive light on your article, it becomes a weak piece of propaganda for materialistic science. When science today does not admit, let alone fully realize the 4 etheric planes – materialistic science is not worthy in the world of the unseen.

JJ: DK tells us the bomb effects the etheric web. Peaceful nuclear energy does not. He compares the explosion of a nuclear bomb to a bee sting for a human. A nuclear reactor would not correspond to anything as painful as this but would be more like eating a handful of bee pollen which supplies the individual with useful energy.

Reader: It is from my perspective that you, JJ, have misinterpreted what is the good and what is the greater good. I fully agree with DK that the release of the energy of the atom can be used for good and that “atomic energy” will liberate humanity.

JJ: If you agree with this then why are you arguing with me?

Reader: He says, “It lies in the hands of the United Nations to protect this released energy from misuse and to see that its power is not prostituted to selfish ends and purely material purposes. It is a “saving force” and has in it the potency of rebuilding, of rehabilitation and of reconstruction.

JJ: He had the hope that the United Nations would protect the world from the misuse of the atomic bomb and other misuses of power by the nations. This certainly does not refute anything I have said. He would probably be disappointed as to how ineffective the UN has been.

Reader: Quoting DK: “Its (atomic energy) right use can abolish destitution, bring civilized comfort (and not useless luxury) to all upon our planet; its expression in forms of right living, if motivated by right human relations, will produce beauty, warmth, color, the abolition of the present forms of disease, the withdrawal of mankind from all activities which involve living or working underground, and will bring to an end all human slavery, all need to work or fight for possessions and things, and will render possible a state of life which will leave man free to pursue the higher aims of the Spirit. The prostituting of life to the task of providing the bare necessities or to making it possible for a few rich and privileged people to have too much when others have too little, will come to an end; men everywhere can now be released into a state of life which will give them leisure and time to follow spiritual objectives, to realize richer cultural life, and to attain a broader mental perspective.” Externalization of the Hierarchy, Page 498

JJ This is a great quote extolling the potential of nuclear power. Thanks for posting it.

Reader: ….and DK continues with, “But, my brothers, men will fight to prevent this; the reactionary groups in every country will neither recognize the need for, nor desire this new world order which the liberation of cosmic energy (even on this initial tiny scale) can make possible…” Externalization of the Hierarchy, Page 499

JJ: And who is currently fighting to prevent this? You for one, followed by Crème, and most of those who falsely call themselves environmentalists.

Reader quoting DK ….”the vested interests, the big cartels, trusts and monopolies that controlled the past few decades, preceding this world war, will mobilize their resources and fight to the death to prevent the extinction of their sources of income; they will not permit, if they can help it, the passing of the control of this illimitable power into the hands of the masses, to whom it rightly belongs.” Page 499

JJ Have you ever wondered how the anti nuclear groups have obtained so much power – to the extent that they have completely shut down the building of nuclear power plants? We haven’t had a new one approved since the early 1980s.

The answer is that the rich and powerful, including many corporations that do not want cheap nuclear power to materialize have given many millions to the anti nuclear groups. This money is used for their advertising, legal fees, law suits against the nuclear industry, bussing protesters around, bailing them out of jail etc.

Reader: If this is so, which I fully agree it is, then you might ask why (like millions of people) am I against the use of today’s nuclear energy? It is because it is not the type of nuclear energy that is desirable. It IS hazardous, essentially dangerous and it is not “clean” energy.

JJ: It only seems undesirable because of the emotional connection it has with the bomb. Nuclear energy is also the cleanest energy we have available with literally no greenhouse gasses. We also have the technology through breeder reactors to completely reprocess all nuclear waste, but lawsuits and political pressure from the anti nuclear groups backed by big money have stopped us in our tracks from using it.

If we can’t use breeder reactors and have to bury some waste at Yucca mountain, this is also safe, about 10,000 times as safe as the reactionaries would lead us to believe.

You must have only skimmed my treatise or you would realize this.

Reader: The right type of nuclear energy is cold fusion. The cold fusion process is the right method of harvesting the energy of the atom. The fusion process of nuclear power is safe and wasteless, it is a process using a simple isotope of water.

JJ: The “right type?” Where do you get the authority to declare what is the right type of nuclear energy?

When DK was talking about the use of atomic energy which would produce the “good, the beautiful and the true” he was talking about fission (“the splitting of the atom”) not fusion (the merging of atoms). He was talking about the current technology.

It is true that he predicted that other types of atomic energy would surface, but, that said, he suggested we plow with the horses we have and use the power of fission which was discovered while Alice A. Bailey was alive.

The big problem with using cold fusion is that we do not have cold fusion available and even if it is developed we do not yet know the pluses and minuses associated with it.

I wouldn’t be a bit surprised though if it did become a source of cheap energy that the anti nuclear crowd would find some reason to protest it. Why? Because most of the leaders are anti free market and anti capitalists and cheap nuclear fusion would be a boon for the free market which could destroy their power base.

Reader: It is important you remember this paragraph that DK has said in Treatise on Cosmic Fire – “One of the main interests in the future will be a tendency towards the elimination of noise, owing to the increased sensitiveness of the race. When the energy of water and of the atom is harnessed for the use of man, our present types of factories, our methods of navigation and of transportation, such as steamers and railway apparatus, will be entirely revolutionized. This will have a potent effect not only on man but on the devas.” TCF, Page 910 Bingo.

JJ: I agree. Nuclear power (using current technology) is clean and silent and has power to give us unlimited electrical power which is also noiseless.

Reader: And don’t forget about the “Technology of Light”, which is the ultimate “energy” goal. But I’ll refrain from talking about it and cease from side-tracking.

JJ: This must be some Crème catch phrase which is meaningless.

Reader: So, to reiterate – today’s procedure of nuclear power is an infantile one, this means of releasing the energy of the atom is like a child playing with a complex, dangerous machine. Do not let the “facts” of exclusive, materialistic science make you believe that today’s means of nuclear power is the ultimate and greatest goal, because it surely is not.

JJ: It’s not as dangerous as the scare mongers would have you believe. There has not been one single death in the Western Hemisphere due to nuclear power generation ever. That’s a safety record that no other source of power can claim, not even windmills.

Using your logic you should not drive a car because something better than the car may come along tomorrow.

New sources of nuclear power may come along, but cold fusion is not here yet – neither are flying cars. We have to plow with the horses we have and the horse we have is the unlimited power of nuclear fission in the new generation of extremely safe power plants.

Reader: When it comes to Sai Baba, again you prove you ignorance, stupidity, and arrogance. Relying on who’s claims that Sai Baba sexually abuses boys? There has been so much junk being said and written about Sai Baba and to believe any of it from hearsay is a dire mistake. Sai Baba is a Cosmic Christ, he is here because of the return of the planetary Christ.

JJ: A Cosmic Christ who has sex with young boys – against their will. I’ve studied this carefully and the evidence is overwhelming. There are hundreds of testimonies about his shenanigans.

Just Google him. Anyone who checks him out and still sees Sai Baba as a Cosmic Christ has to be a true believer exceeding the best of them from the Piscean Age.

(Note: I gave four links which are no longer accessible. There are many good current ones for those who Google “Sai Baba Sexual Abuse”

There’s a lot of truth to the old cliché: “Where there’s smoke there’s fire.”

Clinton was a good example of this. After about a dozen accusations came forward about his indiscretions you just had to figure there was a blue dress out there somewhere.

“The sky is falling…no, I’m tipping over backwards.” Steven Wright

Sept 26, 2003

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

Log on to Freeread Here

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

Gather with JJ on Facebook HERE

The Masters, Devachan and Harmlessness

The Masters, Devachan and Harmlessness

Question: why did DK channel through AAB, when a Master like Jesus could have? Can only Masters who vibrate on certain rays come through to an earth person?

DK is one of the younger masters, only about 300 years in the same body. He received this time consuming job for three reasons.

(1) To free up the time of the senior members of the Hierarchy so they can do their lines of work. The work of the Hierarchy is much more extensive than is realized by disciples. They not only work with human affairs but with all the kingdoms of the earth. This ranges from contact with Shamballa to working with the animal, vegetable and mineral kingdoms, not to mention the deva.

(2) Even though he is a young master he has done much more extensive personal research on the rays and initiations than have some other Masters. Thus he was well qualified to release the needed information.

(3) He needed this assignment to complete his fifth initiation so he can move on to the sixth.

Question: How do the Masters know everything that happens here on Earth?

They do not know everything that is happening. They have the capacity to tune into a person or situation, or even see a picture of the whole, but there are many things they do not see.

The Ancient of Days is the only one here of evolution high enough to be aware of all earth lives at the same moment. This is because we are all esoterically a part of his one body.

A Master may be in close communion with maybe a dozen disciples and then the disciple is in contact with his various students. The Masters are not God, but are more advanced than us humans.

It is not the job of the Masters to work with average humanity. This is the work of the solar angel and its reflections in the material world.

Everyone who is seeking receives all they can handle whether they realize it or not.

I was asked how much time we spend in the after life between lives. The time between lives once averaged 1000-1500 years, but not any more with the current population explosion. DK says there are 60 billion monads designated for this planet, but some of these are not incarnating at present, waiting instead for a period of peace and relative enlightenment.

From my personal research I would say the current time between lives is around 200 years on the average.

Question: How do we know we aren’t already in Devachan right now on Earth when all this could be just part of the whole illusion?

I think almost everyone has asked themselves a question like this including average people who have never heard of the devachan. I think I first had a thought like this as a small child. I would ask myself something like:

“How do I know I am really here and not just dreaming? Wouldn’t it be something if I woke up and found I was really someone or something else?”

The philosopher Descartes asked himself questions like this and he concluded that there was only one thing he knew for sure. He expressed it in the famous phrase: “I think therefore, I am.”

I think that many of us sometimes wonder if life is a dream because all of us have progressed through numerous lives and each time we die it is a little like waking up from a dream and upon crossing over (before entering devachan) physical life will have seemed like a dream.

I’ll bet life seemed like a dream to Marylin (a Keys member) when she was faced with entering that light during her recent heart surgery. We are glad though that she stayed in touch enough to come back to us.

Here is the Key to a happy existence:

No matter where you find yourself accept your circumstances until you have knowledge to produce better circumstances. Having made that acceptance move ahead following the highest you know. When you find “the good the beautiful and the true” incorporate it into your life and continue onward.

Actually, one difference between earth life and devachan is that every project there ends with wonderful success, but here one has more failure than success. This is the lone a dreary world on the outside. Devachan is a bright and glorious world where all our dreams come true.

In devachan we rest and if we labor, even work seems to be a rest.

On earth we labor by the sweat of our brow and undergo great struggle.

We know for sure we are here on the earth and not dreaming, or in devachan because there is struggle, pain, disappointment followed by a little joy and accomplishment now and then. Here is where we build our spiritual muscles. I say this with the realization that from a higher reality this is also a dream.

Question: Why practice harmlessness? Are we supposed to let negative people just walk all over us?

Good question. When we are living in rough surroundings with others who may not believe in, or even understand, harmlessness it may seem almost futile to practice it for some benefit in some far future life.

There are several corrections to this attitude which is helpful.

(1) Harmlessness is not negative passivity, but a positive approach. DK makes this clear also in his writings.

Sometimes it is right to turn the other cheek, but no rule applies in all circumstances.

What would have happened if we just sat around and sang Kumbaya as Hitler was taking over the world? Would our passive approach had been a harmless one?

No. If all nations would have been passive then Hitler would have conquered the world and great harm would have been done.

The fact is this. More often than not the harmless path requires the disciple to take some type of positive action with a view of creating the most beneficial, least harmful results. In the case of World War II the most harmless path was to defeat Hitler.

Sometimes the harmless path will lead to an action of tough love. Sometimes it will lead to immediate peace but often it will lead to great conflict.

Consider the life of Christ, the most harmless of us all.

Did he make people angry?

Yes. But it was not his fault. Instead, it was the fault of the emotionally based people who resisted his teachings.

Now remember the Pendulum Principle and the Middle Way. Just because the harmless path sometimes creates conflict do not get the idea that this will be the normal result of harmlessness.

More often than not harmlessness will create peaceful surroundings, but there are exceptions with results going to the other extreme. True harmlessness requires great power of judgment.

(2) Harmlessness has benefits in the here and now.

The first benefit will be an inner peace that filters down from your soul because you have made the correct choice. This benefit alone is well worth the cultivation of this principle.

The second benefit comes in the realization that many benefits of karma come within the current life. Some of the biggies are delayed to a future life because the circumstances to even things out completely are not available in the present one. Even so, we reap much of what we have sowed in the present life. I am 58 (in 2003) and the older I get the more I realize this is true. Again and again I see that people reap in later life that which they have sowed earlier.

Then too often there are often immediate results. This principle is illustrated in the scriptures:

“A soft answer turneth away wrath.” Proverbs 15:1

Quite often the harmless approach will keep the budding disciple out of a lot of trouble. He will not run from trouble but he will not react with harmful words just to be gutsy or prove a point.

(3) It is true that to perfect harmlessness one must learn the art of detachment from the ego and lower desire nature. One must see himself as the observer and make decisions based on what is best for the whole rather than the individual self. This is difficult, but in the end it works out best for the whole as well as the parts.

Someone asked about Steven Wright whom I quote. He is a famous comic and my favorite.

Here is his most famous quote:

“I bought some powdered water, but I don’t know what to add to it.”

Sept 21, 2003

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

Log on to Freeread Here

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

Gather with JJ on Facebook HERE


Mysteries, Initiations and More

Mysteries, Initiations and More

I was asked to comment on the appearance of Jesus on the road to Emmaus in Luke 24 and more on the higher initiations.

Because we had two entities involved in the life of Christ, (one being the disciple Jesus and the other being the Christ) it makes it awkward in writing to sometimes distinguish between the two. In the case of Luke 24:13-32 the I believe the Master who appeared was Christ and not Jesus. Technically I should have written the Christ.

After the resurrection the Christ did not just go away, but could create a vehicle at will to assist where necessary in initiating the great work. He also worked with Jesus more through overshadowing than divine possession and assisted him. You’ll note in the story in Luke that this entity did not say who he was. But merely testified to the resurrection.

There are degrees of liberation. Jesus attained one degree and the Christ a higher one. As far as incarnations go liberation comes in stages.

First Stage: The pre-initiate Before the first initiation the pilgrim has little choice as to whether or when he can incarnate. This is controlled by karma, group forces, his solar angel and a council of Elder Brethren.

Second Stage: First and Second Degree Initiates. These individuals have worked off a lot of karma and are beginning to understand cyclic and other forces. Between lives they have power to influence their next birth situation. They have some control, but not full control of their incarnations.

Third Stage: Third Initiation Here he becomes a dedicated server and gains ability to choose situations for rebirth where he can make the best use of his talents. He is still subject to the law of cycles.

Fourth Stage: Fourth Initiation He gains freedom from the standard cycles of rebirth and changes of male female energy and works through a higher level of cycles and plans his future lives.

Note: Jesus was a fourth degree initiate, but was brought back to life by the Christ.

Fifth Stage: Fifth Initiation Here he becomes a master and gains power to renew his physical body so he does not have to die or reincarnate until he desires. When he decides he can let his body go and choose to incarnate again for either the sake of service or in preparation for higher initiation.

Sixth Stage: Sixth and seventh Initiation Here he has the freedom to not incarnate again unless he chooses otherwise. He can serve in either of three ways to finish his earth service. (1) He can choose to incarnate. Or (2) He can overshadow disciples and do his work for humanity through them. (3) He can create a temporary body of manifestation by his thought and work among humanity or appear to disciples.

Question: Does the fourth initiation always involve the resurrection of the body? I am specifically thinking of Abraham Lincoln, who obviously never overcame death during his lifetime.

JJ: The fourth initiation is called “The Great Renunciation.” And was passed in the Garden of Gethsemane by Jesus and finished off with the follow through on the cross.

Abraham of the Bible also gives an example of the great sacrifice when he showed a willingness to lose his dream by sacrificing his Son Isaac. We are not told of the sacrifice of Lincoln but I suspect his demanding wife played a role as well as the war.

The disciple has not yet overcome death at this initiation. Instead, he has demonstrated as willingness to let all things held dear go so he can attain the next great revelation.

At the fifth the initiate learns the secret of sustaining life, but it is not until the seventh that he masters matter to the extent that it can be destroyed and rebuilt at will.

The Christ went from his fifth, finished his sixth and began his seventh when he assisted Jesus in returning to life. In addition he was able to manifest in any form he desired, even in the form of Jesus himself if need be.

After demonstrating that death could not hold the initiate the Master Jesus discarded his body and moved on to other work.

Question: One has to also ask one’s self what did Jesus do after he ascended into heaven per the testimony of the apostles?

It was the Christ who demonstrated the ascension. This was a demonstration that the sixth initiation had been passed. Sometimes the sixth initiation is called Ascension.

Question: How could it be that Paul met his dweller on the road to Damascus when, instead, he encountered Christ?

The account des not relate his encounter with the dweller, but with the Christ as you say. In esoteric writings this is called the encounter with “the angel of the presence.”

The encounter with the dweller comes before this.

Here is my take. You can run it by your own souls.

Paul was a sincere student, studying very deeply everything he could get his hands on. He had passed the first and second initiations and was fairly well advanced on the spiritual path, but had some illusions that tricked him into thinking that the destruction of the new Christian religion would preserve his own. As he went about doing this and encountering real people of faith that were imprisoned or destroyed by his support he began to have misgivings. A part of him began to search his soul and another part tried to ignore the problem.

But that something gnawing at his soul began to grow and, as he reflected upon it, he asked God about the Christians – just to make sure he was taking the correct path. When he called out to God he was struck down by his dweller to prevent him getting an answer. As he struggled with his dweller he concluded that this was some kind of devil force actually caused by the Christians and attempted to persecute them all the more. If he destroyed them then maybe the devil would go away.

In this seemingly possessed state he was headed toward Damascus where he met his Lord.

The contrast of his deception by his Dweller with his new realization caused him to go blind until his miraculous healing.

Comment: I don’t think that JJ has ever explicitly said the masters would ever tell a “white lie.”

JJ You are correct. In fact I have taught several times that one of the keys to liberation is honesty and to attain the ability to always abide by our word. I attempt to set that example myself.

The higher lives do have to keep some information from us, however, which could either be dangerous or misleading. Parents are not lying (if done right) when they do not tell a four year old about sex. Even so, we are babes in some ways unprepared for many higher teachings.

Comment: Some are saying you just read the Bailey writings and repeat them in your writings. What do you say?

JJ: I thought I would make some clarifications here as some, when they begin reading the Alice A. Bailey material, think “A-hah. He just studies this stuff and gives it to us as his own.”

First, let me say that it is impossible for any teacher to put forth anything of value without building on a foundation of teachings past to some degree. This even applies to the words of Christ in the New Testament. Quite a few of them are quotes directly from the Old Testament. Then too many of the other teachings were also espoused by numerous teachers in the past not related to Israel.

Does this mean that Jesus was not original?

By no means. When he quoted from the past he shed new light on that which was old. And even though many past teachers taught about love and eternal life, Jesus took the principle to a new dimension of understanding the world had never heard or witnessed.

Even so, I do quote teachers past, but when I am merely presenting their exact teachings or quotes I usually give references. DK is well known for his teachings on the rays and initiations and when I refer to them I assume the student will realize that most of the basic knowledge on these two concepts was revealed by him. Even here I have introduced a number of teachings not covered by him.

We have been talking about the Alice A. Bailey material quite a bit lately, but if you take an overview of my writings you’ll find that many of them cover ideas and principles not elaborated on in the Bailey or any other material.

Consider my books beginning with The Immortal series. Probably less than 10% of the teachings in there are touched upon in the writings of DK.

Then look at my other books such as The Molecular Relationship. DK hinted at the principle, but never explained it to the extent that any reader has discovered it there before reading my book. The Bible gives more hints on this than does DK. Joseph Smith’s teachings also hinted at it, but it took a revelation through the Oneness Principle before I understood it and could write about it.

Next look at my book – The Gathering of Lights. Again DK hints at this principle, but the scriptures talk much more about it than he or any other esoteric writings.

But even here, the understanding of it by the world is so slight that it is barely mentioned by standard Christian writings.

Another book I have written is called The Gods of the Bible. Very little of DK is mentioned here, but the basic esoteric teachings concerning God is taught from the Bible in a way not presented before.

Then we have the Keys writings which is a mixture of many concepts and principles. As I have taught the group here I have tried to give credit where I am merely repeating a teaching from the past. If I do not give credit I assume the reader knows where the idea comes from. For instance, if I say, “the truth shall make you free” I may assume that the reader knows this famous quote came from Jesus. If I write about the rays and initiations I assume you know that DK laid out the foundation teachings on them.

In the process of teaching it often happens that I take an idea from the past and add new light and teachings to it. When this happens it would be untrue to just categorically state that I received it from DK or some other teacher. It would also be a distraction to stop every few paragraphs and relate the sentences that have been covered by teachers past and the new ones covered by me.

Astute students of DK or the Bible can usually discern where I leave off from past teachings and plunge into the new.

Overall, if you look through the archives it will be difficult to find one major post (including this one) that does not present new material not covered the same way by any teacher in the past. (Note the example of Paul and the Dweller for instance in this post).

I say these things not to glorify myself, but to correct the misunderstanding of some and to glorify the One Spirit of God that works through the many creating the Oneness Principle that is available to all who will seek.

As someone pointed out though it is important to run my teachings as well as others through your own souls, for no teacher is without error.

Question: Have you ever heard of “Recurrence”? The idea that at death one returns to the beginning of ones life and relives it over and over?

JJ: This idea comes from a misunderstanding of the devachan. The devachan is a place of bliss, called heaven by some, which is a final resting place (between lives) of good worthy people who are above average spiritually, but have not overcome illusion.

The concept of the Devachan was elaborated on quite a bit by the Theosophical Society and its teachers and mentioned a number of times by DK.

The basic idea is this. When we die we leave this world with many unfulfilled desires and goals. As a reward for those who have lived a good life they are sent to the devachan which is basically a dream state, but one in which the dreams are as real as life on earth.

In the devachan the person can then fulfill his dreams. If he wanted to be a great ball player here on earth and was not able to he will be one there. He will be greater than Babe Ruth and will hear the cheers of adoring fans to his heart’s content as he hits the ball out of the park.

We may live some parts of our life over in devachan, but only if this is our desire.

Devachan may explain why Houdini was never able to contact the earth after his death. If he went to devachan he probably dreamed that he made the contact, thought it was real, but in reality the contact was never made.

Devachan is hinted at in the Bible where it says

“And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.” Rev 14:13

The teaching of devachan is that our works do follow us and we can continue our labors of love.

These are not useless labors for they sharpen our skills and prepare us to do better in our next life.

“I xeroxed my watch. Now I have time to spare.” Steven Wright

Sept 19, 2003

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

Log on to Freeread Here

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

Gather with JJ on Facebook HERE


Questioning DK, Part 2

Questioning DK, Part 2

Question: You have answered most of the questions re why we should question the writings of AAB/DK. However there is one that I have not seen you address on the list. If you would that would be greatly appreciated.

In John 16:25-33 Jesus the man (not Christ speaking through him) says:

“I have overcome the world.”

All Christian tradition holds that after the Resurrection that Jesus had overcome death. You have previously stated your high regard for the Bible and the New Testament.

Then how is it that you take the word of AAB/DK over the Bible and claim that Jesus had to take one more initiation after that to achieve eternal life and become a “master”?

JJ: I don’t see any competition between the two or the taking of one over another. I treat everything I read the same in that if it registers with my soul then I accept it. Both DK and the Bible are earned authorities with me and if something does not register with my soul then I put it on the shelf and continue to contemplate rather than discarding the words.

Actually the Bible has some of the same problems as the AAB material. Just as AAB could have made a wrong choice of words in some of her transcriptions, even so did some of the writers of the scriptures. In addition to this, we do not have original manuscripts of the gospels. I believe the best one is about the 13th copy. Sometimes when the scribes made their copies they placed little notes, adding their own words. Then when the next scribe made his copy he adds in the notes as original text.

If you take a phrase and whisper it around a circle of 13 people you’ll get an idea of the distortion possible.

One of the problems with the words of Jesus which crept in was an alteration of how Jesus actually spoke. When he was speaking to the apostles he would often say something like “come unto Christ all ye who labor and are heavy laden…”

Then when the scripture was written the writer felt he had to be talking about himself since he was the Christ so they changed it to read: “Come unto ME all ye who labor and are heavy laden…”

Another example: “For where two or three are gathered together in God’s name, Christ is in the midst of them

Changed to “For where two or three are gathered together in MY name, there am I in the midst of them”

Jesus taught the apostles about the principle of Christ rather than presenting himself as an all powerful one, yet the apostles and those who followed later liked the idea of a more personal Christ and altered numerous phrases to conform to the idea of an all powerful, all present Jesus. Only Peter and John really grasped how the divine possession worked even though it was explained to them all. This caused some distortion related to the powers and place of Jesus in the scheme of things by numerous writers and scribes.

You quote the scripture “I have overcome the world.”

The original wording here could have been different but we’ll accept it at face value.

A quite literal interpretation if read in the Greek is:

“I have beat the system.”

A hint as to the meaning is given a few verses later:

“And now I am no more in the world, but these (the disciples) are in the world…” John 17:11

This was spoken before the crucifixion and indicates that he beat the system (KOSMOS) by withdrawing from it. The world had no effect on him because his attention was on a higher reality.

Then after the resurrection he stated: “All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.” Matt 28:18

Obviously this does not mean all power as the orthodox understand it. Notice that in the next verse he needs the apostles to go forth and preach the message. Why would Jesus even need them to do work for him if he had all power?”

Does Jesus then have all power so he could snap his fingers and have the whole earth understand the message without the aid of the apostles? Could he snap his fingers and end all suffering and evil? Could he cause the universe to disappear by the power of his thought?

The answer that occurs to every reasonable thinking person is no. If he then does not have all power as orthodoxy presents then what does the statement mean?

Answer: It means that his consciousness has shifted away from the carnal world (system) to the world of spirit and in the realm of spirit resides “all power” which has created all things and is the power behind all things. Jesus was saying that he has tapped into the source of real power and thus has it available.

But tapping into power and using it to fulfill purpose are two different things. The sun is very powerful and has always been there available for us, but even now we are finding new ways to use it’s energy to fulfill our wills.

Even so, was all the power of the Spirit available to Jesus, but even today he is learning new ways to harness the energy.

We are told that overcoming the world is not limited to Jesus:

“For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, [even] our faith. Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? I John 5:4-5

Here we are told that all that is necessary to overcome the world is to believe on Jesus and be “born of God.”

Is overcoming the world the last thing we do in our progression? No. There is no end to our progression. After we overcome the world (shift attention to spirit) then there a next step and then a next and then another still, world without end.

Because Jesus overcame the world, does this mean he is through with incarnating?


Because Jesus was raised from the dead does this mean that he cannot take another body if he so chooses?


If he has “all power” then he can choose to be born again as a babe if he desires.

Because the entity who holds the office of Christ is even higher than Jesus, does this mean that he will never take another initiation or be born again as a babe?

No. Again he has to power to fulfill his will in this matter and if a mission requires that he be born again as a babe, overshadow another or change bodies all this can be done.

It is amazing how the standard Christian, in one breath, will say that Jesus can do anything, but then, in the next, deny that he could be born again or numerous other things as taught in the Ancient Wisdom.

Even the Ancient of Days will be born again near the end of the race of man. He was the first man and will be the last.

At present he is preparing for what is called a cosmic initiation where the point of tension is humanity itself. It is written:

“This initiation requires the reorganisation of the energies flowing through and composing that “centre which we call the race of men”; this creates a rearrangement within the centre itself, and thus brings into manifested expression certain aspects and qualities-always inherent in those energies-which have not hitherto been recognised.” Rays and Initiations, Page 550

Jesus was a fourth degree initiate after the crucifixion and the Christ passed his sixth and began his seventh. To finish his seventh will requite him to successfully make his second appearance and move humanity ahead so the Ancient of Days can take his own initiation. Christ thus not only serves humanity but advances his own consciousness.

Question: If principles are always true then are they operating and effecting us now, in the present?

Yes. True principles are always in effect all around us. The universe is built upon true principles, held together by them and will be dissolved by them. True principles govern our lives, our deaths, our relationships, our sorrow and our joys.

The bird flies making use of true principles, yet does not understand the principle of flight or realizes it exists. So it is with us. We live in a sea of principles which govern all things, yet until, we touch the soul we do not even realize what a principle is.

Question: Would other authors write about them and not really know them in fullness? like in business, self help and just the common talk of people today?

Yes, many of the best authors touch upon a principle. Some have a sense of that which they have discovered while others do not discern them from facts. Sometimes you can find a principle in a book written by an author that does not know what a principle is.

When the seeker gains a true understanding of the language of principles his learning is greatly accelerated.

Question: Are some principles highlighted in modern literature, movies, songs, etc…?

JJ: Yes, principles are touched upon more and more through the media as humanity progresses. These principles are usually lightly touched upon but are rarely explained.

Some principles touched upon in the movies for instance are:

(1) The force from Star Wars. This is actually the life principle that flows through us from and through higher lives and spheres. The highest among us only has a vague understanding of this principle.

(2) The female creative principle of allowing the male seed to be planted. The best movie that illustrates this is Rocky #2. Rent this and watch the principle work when the wife revives and tells Rocky that he must “win.” This stirs the spirit within you because a principle is at work.

(3) The principle of sacrifice illustrated beautifully at the end of Titanic.

(4) The principle of the intuitive approach to problem solving illustrated by Captain Kirk in the original Star Trek.

(5) The principle of illusion from the Matrix.

(6) The principle of Faith in Seabiscuit

(7) The principle of duality as demonstrated daily by the political debates on TV and radio.

Sept 18, 2003

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

Log on to Freeread Here

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

Gather with JJ on Facebook HERE

Clarifying the Overshadowing

Clarifying the Overshadowing

A reader quotes some of my teachings on divine possession and quotes this scripture.

‘And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you forever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be IN you.’ (John 14: 16-17)

Question: The scripture says “he may abide with you forever”, but in the article you said his mental body will dwell in the body of a disciple for a period of time. So, which is it? Forever, or for a period of time? You mention several temporary overshadowings, and even the overshadowing of Jesus by the Christ for only three years. Can a master overshadow more than one person at once? If not, and if it’s going to be “forever”, how is this going to work.

JJ: The scripture concerning the Second Comforter has a dual meaning. Joseph Smith was correct when he said it was Christ communing with the disciple and sometimes abiding “in” him, but it is more than this. This Second Comforter is also related to the Christ principle. Paul expressed this when he said:

“Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God.” Phil 2:5-6

An overshadowing by Christ is a temporary thing, but the link established causes “this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus.” This is a permanent link to the Oneness Principle causing the mind of Christ to be with the disciple forever.

A more specific scripture referring to the divine possession is: “Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come IN to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.” Rev 3:20

Question: Why is it necessary for a mental body to reside within the physical body? Even our own mental body? Why can’t it be wherever it wants to be or considers itself to be, and still be connected to the physical body?

JJ: If the astral and mental bodies were not linked to the physical the we would not be alive. If we want to interact in the physical and be alive here then we must accept the package necessary for life.

The same goes for a Master. One like the Christ has the ability to create a temporary physical body when necessary, called, in the East, a Mayavirupa, but when working with general humanity the Hierarchy prefers to work directly through disciples. This is safer and more effective in the long run.

If a master wishes to work with humanity through a disciple then he must follow certain laws just as you or I do. They work with most disciples through the science of impression, by stimulating the mind of a disciple to see certain principles or ideas.

When the Master decides that closer contact with humanity is needed then he will overshadow the disciple. This is a stronger link allowing the Master to see through the eyes of the disciple. Then when an important work is to be initiated the Master will actually send his consciousness into the same body occupied by the disciple. The consciousness of the Master and the disciple blend and merge until they become one in consciousness. This happened to Jesus at his baptism.

When using impression or overshadowing the Master can work with more than one disciple, but in the case of a divine possession he may be limited to the one physical body.

For instance, when the entity who is Christ was in Jesus he was only in Jesus and no other person. Keep in mind that the Christ consciousness is different from the entity who is Christ. This consciousness is available to us all.

Question: At the baptism of Jesus, when John the Baptist witnessed the Christ descend upon Jesus and overshadow him, he also heard a voice from heaven declare: “This is my beloved son.” If the Christ had already entered Jesus, who was the voice, and to whom was the heavenly voice referring?

JJ: This was the Ancient of Days, the Father of humanity. DK also confirms this. Christ, however is also a Father in relation to Jesus. This is why he is called “the Father and the Son.”

The reader quotes: “Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.” John 14:10

Question: You said the mental body of the Father takes up residence within the physical body of the Son. So that would explain the phrase ‘the Father that dwelleth in me’, but he also says ‘I am in the Father’. I don’t understand how that would work out?

JJ: Both the disciple and the Master have to adjust to each other’s vibration and consciousness and blend and merge. This is a major task as evidenced by the fact that right after Christ came into Jesus that he went into the wilderness for forty days. The reason for this is that it takes about 40 days for both entities to adjust. After the adjustment the disciple shares the consciousness of the Master as if they are one entity. He is in the Master and the Master is in him.

After the adjustment is made the Master can leave at any time his full attention is required elsewhere, but a significant link would remain.

Question: I am having trouble with the distinction between temporary overshadowings and permenant overshadowings. Revelations seems to imply permanence. i.e “am set down with my Father in his throne”.

JJ: There is no such thing as a permanent overshadowing. For one thing as the physical body where this happens is not permanent. But there is a permanent link and when the Christ Consciousness is attained in fullness the disciple then symbolically sits on the throne of God forever.

Question: Why do two mental bodies have to both reside in the same physical body in order to have such a close connection? Isn’t it enough to be closely tied in through the Oneness Principle?

JJ No. The Oneness Principle is not enough for certain types of work. For example, if you attain to the Oneness Principle and then die, your link with this principle remains. In the next world you can tune into the Divine Mind even better than here, but you hare handicapped in doing certain types of work because you have no physical body. Thus, even the disciple who has overcome is drawn back into incarnation to perform service that is not available in the afterlife.

Even so with a Master. There are certain types of service with humanity that require him at times to work directly with the consciousness of a disciple in connection with the physical body.

Comment: As I see it, the only distinction between a divine possession and a demonic possession, besides purpose, is one is voluntary and the other is involuntary.

JJ: There are a number of distinctions and that is one of them. A dark entity will seek to possess by means of the astral body. The disciple thus gains safety for himself by polarizing himself in the mind or above.

The dark entity does not seek to serve but to satisfy selfish desire by force of will.

The Master honors the free will of the disciple, allowing him to make all the decisions while he is visiting. He comes not for self but for loving service. He will leave any time the disciple should make the request.

Question: As I understand it, the highest consciousness achievable by a DB is the mental plane, but the highest consciousness achievable by a master would be much higher. Could not a master make a higher contact with an advanced disciple on the intuitive plane or even on a higher plane?

JJ: This happens all the time through the use of the science of impression. Impressions from a Master are sent and received on the intuitive plane and then penetrate to the lower planes.

But to accomplish certain specific work the Master must descend in consciousness to the plane of the mind and link with the disciple at least this far down.

The Molecular Relationship cannot be established by using the intuitive plane only. A Master must descend to the mind (and the mind linked to the physical) and work with them.

Question: Divine possession, it seems to me is portrayed at the ultimate contact with the higher lives, but it is also the highest form of contact between us and the DB’s as well. Or am I missing something?

JJ: Those in incarnation who follow the dark path do not want to be possessed against their will any more than you or I. Standard possession that we hear about is done by very low grade entities and mostly affects the weak minded or emotionally disturbed and has nothing to do with the work of a dark master.

A Dark Master seeks to control disciples through deceit and false promises. One advanced on the dark path can overshadow a disciple, but I am not aware of a possession on the dark side as happens with the Brotherhood of Light where two occupy a body at the same time. If the dark brother does take over he will attempt to force his acolyte completely out.

Divine possession or sharing of life and consciousness as happened with Jesus is the highest contact while in a physical body.

Keep in mind that just because we are in a physical body does not mean that the consciousness is polarized there. The disciple is polarized in the mind or higher in or out of the physical.

Question: There are two conflicting quotes. (from DK) One says that Jesus vacated his body so that the Christ could take over. (Note: I have not found a reference where JJ teaches this. He teaches they shared Jesus’ mental body.) and Another quote that says that Jesus was a willing CHANNEL for the powerful will of the Christ. I mention this for two reasons: (1) seeming conflicts about over-shadowing, and (2) the current discussion over the divine origins of the writings of AAB.

JJ: Yes, this is one of the few real contradictions in DK’s writings. I know that Jesus did not vacate his body, but shared it with the Christ. DK seems to also agree with this in most of his comments about the Christ and Jesus working together. It may be possible that Jesus left his body for short periods so the Christ could do certain work, but overall they were both in the same body at the same time. The scriptures also bear witness of this as I have previously quoted. Here is one of many: “the Father is in me, and I in him.” John 10:38

It is also possible that Alice A. Bailey used the word “vacated” when DK intended another.

There are cases where the disciple does vacate his body and trades it with a higher entity so certain work can be accomplished, but this was not one of them. If Jesus was completely vacated from his body he could not have passed through the third and fourth initiations during his life as taught in the Bailey writings.

“I planted some bird seed. A bird came up. Now I don’t know what to feed it”. Steven Wright

Sept 16, 2003

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

Log on to Freeread Here

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

Gather with JJ on Facebook HERE

Apollonius and History

Apollonius and History

Reader Question:: What did this Apollonius of Tyana ever say or do that is recorded that indicate he was someone taking a “5th initiation”?

JJ: There is just one piece of information needed to give us a complete picture. This is relating to the huge difference between Jesus as a teacher and Apollonius, which is this.

Jesus was a third degree initiate (working on his fourth) but was overshadowed by the Christ, a sixth degree initiate (working on his seventh).

Because of this we actually only have a record of Jesus and The Christ speaking bas they are of one mind. Note these references of the two in one as evidenced from these scriptures:

“For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.” John 12:49

“Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.” John 14:10

“For I have given unto them THE WORDS WHICH THOU GAVEST ME; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.” John 17:8

Here Jesus clearly tells us that the great and eternal words he spoke were not his own but from the one who “dwelleth” within him.

These eternal words thus did not come from the third degree initiate Jesus but from the sixth degree initiate, the Christ. Even if Jesus did return as Apollonius, his words and acts would not have had the repercussions as did the higher initiate the Christ.

We do have some of the words and acts of Apollonius and they are quite impressive. His deeds were perhaps more impressive than his teachings.

Verifying the historical accuracy of the words and deeds attributed to Apollonius are difficult, as it is with Jesus. One difference is that there are enough historical references to Apollonius that there is no question (in the eyes of historians) that he was a true historical person.

There were numerous writings about him that were destroyed by zealous Christians who did not want any competing historical person to take away from the dominance of Jesus as a worker of miracles.

Most of what we know about Apollonius was written by his disciple Damis who traveled by his side and recorded details from personal experience. Unfortunately the original writings of Damis were destroyed, but the essence was preserved by the writer Philostratus who was commissioned by the empress Julia Domna around 205 AD. This point is a historical fact that tells us that numerous materials about Apollonius were available.

There are some pretty fascinating accounts surrounding Apollonius that remind one of a figure like Jesus.

For instance, here is an account of an appearance before the emperor Domitian

“When nearly one hundred years old, he was brought before the Emperor at Rome, accused of being an enchanter. He was taken to prison. While there he was asked when he would be at liberty? ‘To-morrow, if it depends on the judge; this instant, if it depends on myself.’ Saying this, he drew his leg out of the fetters, and said, ‘You see the liberty I enjoy.’ He then replaced it in the fetters.

“At the tribunal he was asked : ‘Why do men call you a god?’

“’Because,’ said he, ‘every man that is good is entitled to the appellation .’

“’How could you foretell the plague at Ephesus?’

“He replied : ‘By living on a lighter diet than other men.’

“His answers to these and other questions by his accusers exhibited such strength that the Emperor was much affected, and declared him acquitted of crime; but said he should detain him in order to hold a private conversation. He replied : ‘You can detain my body, but not my soul; and, I will add, not even my body. Having uttered these words he vanished from the tribunal, and that same day met his friends at Puteoli, three days’ journey from Rome.” From the Monkey of Christ Chapter 20

Here are some other points of interest.

(1) Some accounts report he was born of a virgin accompanied by the singing of angels.

(2) He was reported to appear in several towns within one day that were several days journey apart. (3) He cast out devils and healed the sick

(4) He was said to read minds

(5) It was said he could speak every language on the planet.

(6) Many called him the Son of God.

(7) The voice of God spoke approving words as he entered the temple of Diana.

(8) He rose a girl from the dead

(9) There are accounts that he rose from the dead and appeared to disciples.

(10) The modern pictures of Jesus are said to be patterned after the image on the numerous ancient statures of Apollonius.

The question is not whether we accept Jesus or Apollonius as historical characters. I believe they both are. Even so arguments can be made for or against the reality of either one of them.

If Apollonius is real it on no way diminishes the Bible account of Jesus and if the Bible is literally true it does not diminish Apollonius.

As seekers of truth our duty is to find as much truth as we can about both of them.

When we reach a point where there are not enough facts to guide us then let us look at principles which never fail.

Jesus said this: “Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.” John 14:12

In the Aquarian gospel he says: “What I have done all men can do, and what I am all men shall be.” Chapter 178:46

The principle is that all of us are reflections of God and are evolving to become like Christ.

It should be no wonder to us that those who take upon then the name of Jesus Christ (One who seeks to lift up his fellow man – see archives) will become great teachers as well as workers of miracles.

It is interesting that since the birth of the Common Era there are three mysterious persons who are seen as so much larger than life of whom orthodox historians question their reality.

The first is Jesus. The second is Apollonius. And the third is King Arthur

It’s interesting how trinities always seem to come into play as we investigate the mysteries.

I believe that all three of these characters are real entities. Some things about them have been distorted, but all three deserved to be seen as larger than life.

As far as Vulcan goes, seekers are justified in being skeptical of its physical reality. It would have to be so small to avoid detection that it may not even be classified as a planet by scientists if discovered.

If DK is correct that Vulcan is within the orbit of Mercury then there are two possibilities.

(1) It was physical but in recent history its globe moved to a higher vibration (from globe 4 to globe 5). This would make it invisible to us now, but would have been visible to the ancients.

(2) DK said that Vulcan and the light of the sun are one. This could indicate that Vulcan is a globe inside the sun itself, representing the First Ray aspect. Some of the ancients taught that there were globes or spheres within the Sun. Forget not that it is a fact a million earths could fit within the sun. This may seem fanciful, but never forget the words of Shakespeare.

“There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.: –Hamlet, I:5

Then, as I said, it is possible that DK made a mistake. If he did he was still attempting to follow a correct principle. That is, there must be seven sacred planets which represent the seven rays in our solar system. If there is no Vulcan then another planet would represent this ray as one of the “seven spirits before the throne.”

As far as Leadbeater being a source of knowledge of Vulcan Alice A. Bailey (not DK) did not trust his writings that much. She said:

“Books were being published at Adyar by Mr. Leadbeater that were psychic in their implications and impossible of verification, carrying a strong note of astralism. One of his major works, Man: Whence, How and Whither, was a book that proved to me the basic untrustworthiness of what he wrote. It is a book that outlines the future and the work of the Hierarchy of the future, and the curious and arresting thing to me was that the majority of the people slated to hold high office in the Hierarchy and in the future coming civilisation were all Mr. Leadbeater’s personal friends. I knew some of these people-worthy, kind, and mediocre, none of them intellectual giants and most of them completely unimportant.” Autobiography of Alice A. Bailey, Page 171

DK indicates he will teach again starting in 2025. Perhaps some of us will live to ask him to explain himself. My guess is that the answer will be very interesting and enlightening.

Member comment: I’ve been reading some of the Bailey writings and to me it is like trying to understand a government instruction manual.

JJ There is a big difference between a government manual and DK’s writings.

You can read the government’s text until the cows come home and still you do not have a clue.


When you study DK, pieces fall together and eventually you understand.

The government makes the simple complex. DK is truly explaining that which is complex to begin with.

My socks DO match. They’re the same thickness. Steven Wright

Sept 13, 2003

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

Log on to Freeread Here

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

Gather with JJ on Facebook HERE


Questioning DK

Questioning DK

A reader asks: How about you? Have you read anything in the Alice A. Bailey writings that make you question or with which you disagree?

JJ: There have been a number of things that threw me for a loop when I first came across them, but after approaching them with an open mind, doing research and contemplation I have resolved most of them.

There are a number of his teachings of which I do not have a enough information to pass a full judgment and cannot verify as true or false from an intellectual standpoint. These are also teachings that I cannot rule out, but because he is an earned authority with me I continue to think upon them. Usually more light comes when I do.

Another point of interest is that I have often received knowledge and principles independent of any material that I have read and when this happens I often will later be reading DK and there it has been hiding all along. When this happens I see why I missed it because he hints at or talks around what I have received. When I see an insight I received that was hidden in his writings I then know that he also knows.

The only other writing this happens with is the scriptures. I will receive something and then discover it is subtly taught already by Jesus or one of the prophets that few have ever noticed.

When he leaves metaphysics and discusses politics, current events or problem solving I can usually see his point but sometimes I think his vision is not expansive enough because he lives such a sheltered existence. As I have said, a beaver can build a better beaver dam than a human and a human can solve certain human problems better than the masters. Where the attention of a life form is, there will be his talent.

A reader comments: I have read some of AAB and quite frankly I don’t see the great disparity of intelligence that you claim. Perhaps that “intelligence” is mostly just a talent for obfuscation?

JJ: I’m curious how much of DK you have read. Have you read 500 pages or more?

If you have read a book or more of each of these two I’m surprised you do not see the wide chasm of difference.

To me the difference is as great as that between Barbara Streisand and Einstein. You only need about a paragraph from each to tell they are written by two different people.

Read over the 14 rules of while magic, for instance. If you then read through all the writings that Alice A. Bailey wrote on her own you cannot find one statement equivalent to the least of them.

I would say it would take about 100 pages of Alice A. Bailey’s personal writings to equal the light in one page of DK’s. This is a huge difference to me that testifies that Alice A. Bailey could have never written the DK material on her own.

I am sure that a sample of DK’s handwriting would look much different than Alice A. Bailey’s. I could probably come pretty close to guessing what it would look like.

Reader: I have no particular reason to believe that she was deliberately deceptive but that doesn’t mean she was absolutely correct as to the source.

JJ: This is something we must always consider until it is either proven intellectually or by soul contact. There are many who claim to represent a master who write with enough believability to capture the minds of many when their source is not connected to the Brotherhood of Light.

Reader: As I mentioned before, multiple personality disorder is one possibility (and the other “personality” could have demonstrated greater apparent intelligence – a very difficult quality to measure accurately.

JJ: The problem is that Alice A. Bailey never showed any signs of multiple personalities. She led a very regulated orderly life and was known for her consistency. There is also no troubled emotional state in her handwriting. It is very obvious in the handwriting of people with this disorder. I have never heard of a multiple personality showing a far superior intelligence to the original personality. A personality change does not cause a rise in consciousness.

Reader: Mostly I see a lot of incomprehensible verbiage, which in itself is highly suspect in my opinion.

JJ: Actually, a lot of people feel this way when they first start to read him because he is difficult to understand in the beginning. He makes no apology for his writing style. Instead, he says this about it, as I recall: (1) He says his writings are not for everyone, but will truly be understood by a small handful. This small number of individuals will then present them to the world in their own way.

This is what I do in this group. Even though DK is not my only source of teachings his books are a major one and many of my writings you enjoy were inspired by something he has written. When this happens I take the principle and attempt to put it in easy to understand language.

(2) He says he does not write to give out easy to understand data. He writes from the “universal to the particular.” In other words he writes around a subject or principle without actually giving it to you in easy to understand language.

Why does he do this?

He says he does this so the disciples of the world who read his material can practice using their intuition and find the core meaning on their own. When this happens the seeker will have much more than a memorized piece of data. He will then own the principle and have a deep understanding.

This method makes perfect sense to me for there have been many times that he has circled the principle, hinting at it, but not outright blurting it out. Then the flashing forth comes and I understand and I take great joy in the light revealed.

This has never happened with Alice A. Bailey’s material that she wrote herself.

If you find the writings difficult should you just give up? No. You must do what I did. At the time I read the first book almost every other sentenced seemed to attack my cherished beliefs, but I recognized a great intelligence there and I literally forced myself to read on. It was not long before 2+2 began to equal 4.

One thing that will help a new reader (something I did not have when I started) is to get a glossary of Hindu Buddhist and Theosophical terms. Look up every key word you do not understand. This will make reading slow at first but it is well worth the effort.

Google “Occult Glossary.” This will be a big help.

Reader: After all, of all these “invisible” planets why did HPB and AAB pick “Vulcan” which just by chance was something science believed at one time (but was later disproven)?

JJ: I would not be surprised if Vulcan were discovered some day, but I also would not be surprised if there were no Vulcan at all. It is possible that DK mistakenly put the planet into his astrological calculations, but even a master can make a mistake. This would not nullify the many truths he has revealed that are confirmed by the soul. Most students however, believe that Vulcan exists in etheric matter invisible to the human eye.

Reader: How about all those other “facts” she gave that we can’t check out? That in particular bothers me. If I can find obvious fault with what can be questioned then I am doubly suspicious of that which cannot be.

JJ If a teacher gives out a few fantastic facts now and then, you are right. They cannot be verified. BUT when a teacher writes millions of words in 20 books there are enough facts to build a case.

I have said that a principle can reveal a thousand facts, but it also works the other way around. A thousand true facts are pieces of a giant jigsaw puzzle that start to paint a picture of a principle.

The facts of a false teacher are not true pieces and paint no picture of a greater principle. But the facts of a true teacher begin to add up to principles after they are put together.

This is a quality I have found in the DK writings. After a while his facts add up to principles and speak the language of the soul.

Right now I’m having amnesia and deja vu at the same time. Steven Wright

Sept 12, 2003

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

Log on to Freeread Here

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

Gather with JJ on Facebook HERE

More on Jesus and DK

More on Jesus and DK

A reader said she read some text in Isis Unveiled that doesn’t support the 100 BC birth of Christ.

The plot thickens!

Actually, HPB writes all over the place. It depends on who she is quoting. Most of her writing in the Secret Doctrine and Isis consists of quotes from obscure sources on which she then comments. She often just throws them out for consideration and then seems to take the side of the original writer to see where it takes her. It is said that she had thousands of sources for these two volumes, an almost supernatural amount for that time of limited access. On a side note she claimed such access because her master brought up to her etheric vision many of these sources she desired.

She was indeed the originator (at least in theosophical circles) of the 100 BC theory for the birth of Christ. Here is a quote from a theosophical writer:

The 100 B.C. theory (the precise date is sometimes given differently) was introduced by H.P. Blavatsky in – “Isis Unveiled” Vol. 2 p. 201. She cites Eliphas Levi “La Science Des Esprits” (Paris, Germer Balliere, 1865, a publisher with offices in London and New York also.) Levi there printed the Jewish accounts. His book has not been translated, but it is in the S.P.R. Library. Although she did not always commit herself to the theory, H.P.B. did endorse it in several places, notably in 1887 in two articles “The Esoteric Character of the Gospels” and her response in French to the Abbe Roca’s “Esotericism of Christian Dogma”. Both are in Collected Writings Vol. 8 – see especially pages, 189, 224, 380-2 and 460-1. Among scholars she cited Gerald Massey in support, but added (p. 380) “Our Masters affirm the Statement.”

In 1881, too, K.H. wrote footnotes to some Levi articles, and said of the doctrine of Jesus, both public and private, “But he preached it a century before his birth.” (Paradoxes of the Highest Science”).

Among later Theosophists, G. de Purucker was firm in support of the theory. His comments in 1934 about the “Real Birth-Date of Jesus” are included in “Studies in Occult Philosophy” (1945) p. 426-8. “The Statement” he noted “is made from our esoteric records; but these esoteric records also are largely based on astronomical and genuinely astrological wisdom.” Each Messianic [40] Cycle of about 2160 years had its own Messiah “and the Messiah of the present Messianic Cycle was the power, the influence, working through H.P.B.”

Mead (A secretary to H. P. Blavatsky) himself alluded guardedly to these experiments in his book, “Did Jesus Live 100 Years B.C.? (T.P.H. 1903) which was a careful account of the Jewish and early [41] Christian material relevant to the question. Speaking of the occult researchers with whom he worked he observes “Now, this handful of friends of mine who are endowed in this special fashion are unanimous in declaring that “Jeschu”, the historical Jesus, lived a century before the traditional date.” (p. l9) He gives the impression that there were several researchers, but I suspect it was mainly Leadbeater. Mead did not commit himself in the end of the book, and he made no appeal to the authority of the Masters.

In addition to this KH in the Mahatma Letters (written by HPB) states: “John the Baptist, having never heard of Jesus who is a spiritual abstraction and no living man of that epoch.’ (M.L. Sinnett 3rd ed. p. 409)

The only trouble with these KH sources through the Mahatma Letters is that DK stated that most of them were fabricated by H. P. Blavatsky. (That may be one reason Theosophists do not accept AAB) Even so they do affirm that she subscribed to this idea.

You also have to consider that the quote in Isis was from earlier in her life and she probably formulated more concrete ideas later on.

I have a feeling that Alice A. Bailey did receive something on this subject and wrote it in a letter. Whether it will ever show up is hard to say.

New question: “Could Alice A. Bailey have fabricated DK’s writings and just made up all the material?

“What evidence can you site that DK is on the side of light and love? Is there any evidence (obvious or subjective) that raises concerns that he may be on the dark side?”

In the past we have spent considerable time talking about the differences between light and dark and of course these can be applied to this question. But we want to go beyond what we have discussed in the past and talk about specifics as it applies to DK. Is there anything he said or taught that raises a red flag with you? Does it cause you to reject the idea that he is indeed a Master? How do you reconcile teachings that trouble you with an acceptance of other things he may have said.

No one commented on the first part of the question which reads: “Could Alice A. Bailey have fabricated DK’s writings and just made up all the material?”

Before we answer this, the question to be asked is what are the possible origins of the DK material? Here are the possibilities:

(1) Alice A. Bailey was a clever ambitious girl and made them all up. (2) She received the writings of a Master as represented. (3) She received the writings from a dark brother disguising himself as a brother of light. (4) She received the writings from a higher intelligence that is neither dark or light, but just screwing with us. (5) She received the writings from her subconscious mind. (6) She received them from her solar angel.

Interestingly, in relation to this question, I found a helpful piece of information today – a sample of Alice A. Bailey’s handwriting. This gives us powerful evidence in answering the first possibility.

Being an experienced handwriting analyst I can tell you several things it reveals.

The thing that stands out first is she saw herself as a strong personality, capable of influencing others and dominating a situation.

She was very passionate, but with emotions under control. She also had some suppression which probably contributed to her health problems later in life.

She was very determined and decisive, loved to work with people. She had a good imagination with her mind exploring the abstract as well as right human relations. Her weakness was the physical side of life, sometimes not following through to insure the financial means she needed.

She liked responsibility and liked to lead. She was fairly honest and straightforward. She had some childlike qualities and faith.

The big questions is this. Was she intelligent enough to have fabricated the writings of DK?

The answer is a definite no according to her handwriting. She was a little above average in intelligence, but her native intelligence was far from the quality needed to write something like Treatise on Cosmic Fire, or even the 14 rules of white magic.

She was methodical, a good student, but did not have a penetrating mind, was not particularly perceptive or innovative. She was a team player. She was not the deep thinker compared to the author of the writings of DK.

What intelligence was she capable of displaying? Fortunately, we have the answer for she wrote several books without DK’s help.

In fact, the comparing of her writings to that of DK is the most astounding proof that she did indeed receive the writings of DK from somewhere higher than her personality self.

If you read some of her own words such as “Consciousness of the Atom” and compare them to “White Magic” you will see the difference between night and day.

Her own writings reveal the intelligence and personality as revealed in her handwriting. In fact when I finally found her handwriting I saw nothing to surprise me. It was about what I had expected, based on my knowledge of her own writings.

On the other hand, if she had indeed fabricated the DK writings I would have expected something entirely different. There would have been evidence of super intelligence as well as deceit.

To create two styles of writings is difficult enough, but to create two levels of intelligence consistent throughout the two sets of writings is close to impossible.

The most difficult thing I have ever written were the dialog for Philo, the bad guy in my books. It was very difficult indeed to put myself in his mindset and write with his intelligence.

In my mind then, there is no doubt that Alice A. Bailey did not fabricate the higher writings of DK. She did receive them from somewhere above the personality level.

Now the question is this. Are there any internal problems with the writings that indicate they may not be from a Master?

We have just discussed perhaps the most difficult one to explain and that is his statement that Jesus was Apollonius. The conflict here is that they were both supposed to have been born around the same time. But even here, as I pointed out, there are alternative explanations that could resolve the problem such as an overshadowing or historical error in the birth dates.

He definitely made a number of mistakes in his predictions. Does this mean he is not a master? No it does not for not even a master can predict the future with 100% accuracy.

In fact, true fulfillment of precise prophesy is so rare that if a person can achieve 50% accuracy in prediction one must call him as true of a prophet as can be had in history.

I would say that DK was roughly about 50% accurate with much of the other 50% that seems incorrect being behind in the timeline.

Most prophets and psychics are less than 10% accurate and not much better than the man on the street. The famous Edgar Casey was probably about 30% accurate, but even this brought him a lot of fame.

Joseph Smith was about 50% accurate.

Nostradamus rarely made specific prophesies. His Quatrains were nebulous enough that accuracy cannot be tabulated.

The Bible Code is another that does not seem accurate. It finds lots of past prophecies that fit their criteria, but I have seen none for the future that have been accurate. There’s quite a few that have not been accurate such as predicting Gore would be president, predicting nuclear war by 1997 and then 2000, failed predictions on dates of destruction of Boston and Chicago. It also predicted that Benjamin Netanyahu would not live to finish his term. He is still alive and did finish his term.

Larry brings up an interesting conflict on DK’s teaching about the planet Vulcan which exist within the obit of Mercury.

On the other hand, DK also says there are 70 planets in our solar system and most of them are invisible being composed of etheric matter or perhaps he is counting the planetoids. It is possible that Vulcan exists just above our physical vision.

Overall I would say that there have been several things that have made me wonder but nothing to discount the fact that DK is a master. This is especially true when we realize that even masters do make mistakes.

How about you? Have you read anything in the Alice A. Bailey writings that make you question or with which you disagree?

“It’s a small world, but I wouldn’t want to have to paint it.” Steven Wright

Sept 8, 2003

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

Log on to Freeread Here

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

Gather with JJ on Facebook HERE

Jesus and Apollonius

Jesus and Apollonius

A reader brought up the discrepancy that the Bailey writings tell us that Apollonius and Jesus were the same person, yet they were apparently born around the same time period. She wants my thoughts on the matter.

JJ At the time this was brought up I had never heard of this discrepancy before. There are still a number of questions I have that I have not received an answer on myself. Sometimes I am just given the answer but more often than not I must search intensely for it. The general principle for all of us is this. Find out all you can on your own first. If that does still not yield the answer continue to place attention on it and search. This will build the point of tension and the answer will eventually come. But to be successful you must be as the little child and look at all things no matter how they differ with what you have been taught.

I have gathered together quit a bit of information on Apollonius, but have just taken the time to go through a portion of it and have not reached a final conclusion.

Here are some of my thoughts on the matter.

There are some mysteries associated with Jesus and the Christ which have not been clearly revealed by the Hierarchy. I think the reason for this is that the orthodox association with the Christ is so strong that they feel the time is not yet right to disturb the waters with strong authority which is associated with true revelation.

That said here is DK’s controversial statement:

“As Apollonius of Tyana, He (Jesus) took the fifth initiation and became a Master of the Wisdom.” Initiation Human and Solar, Page 57

Now the problem here is that most scholars believe that Jesus and Apollonius were both born right around the same time period, close to 4-1 BC. Therefore, by normal reasoning it would seem they were contemporaries and it would have been impossible for Jesus to have been Apollonius.

The most probable esoteric way around this dilemma is that, after the crucifixion that Apollonius vacated his body and Jesus walked in and continued with his work.

A second possibility is that Apollonius was overshadowed by Jesus.

A third possibility is that they both belonged to the same oversoul.

But some students of Apollonius have another exotic explanation. They say that Jesus and Apollonius are one and the same person. The story is that around the age of 30 Apollonius happened by the Jerusalem area and started teaching. He stayed there for over three years, as Jesus, and was crucified, but survived, left the area and never returned. He lived to around the age of 100.

Other explanations revolve around the idea that our history of that period is very vague and we have many dates and details wrong.

Around this direction Benjamin Crème actually presented an interesting possibility. He said: “The Disciple Jesus (24 BC to 9 AD), who is now the Master Jesus, was born in Palestine as a third-degree initiate. When He went out of incarnation at the Crucifixion, Jesus was a fourth-degree initiate. In His next incarnation, as Apollonius of Tyana (16AD to c.97 AD), He became a Master (fifth-degree initiate). He died in India.”

This is an interesting thought and it would harmonize DK’s controversial statement, but there is no historical evidence that Jesus was born as early as 24 BC or that the birth of Apollonius was as late as 16 AD.

Another interesting twist comes from H. P. Blavatsky and expanded somewhat by the Theosophical Society.

They do not accept the writings of Alice A. Bailey so they were not trying to harmonize DK’s paradox. Even so, they have an explanation that does this.

They say the real Jesus was born over a hundred years earlier than the Biblical Jesus. His real name was Jeschu Ben Pandira. He was really stoned to death and later “hung on a tree” as described by Paul. (See Galations 3:13) After the death of Pandira several initiates got together and compiled the Gospel story loosely based on his life with incidents and teachings from several other initiates mixed in. It was a combination of fact and fiction created to teach certain principles and subtly give out the principles of initiation. For some reason they moved the time frame ahead a hundred years and if this account is true they would have had to go to enormous pains to create a new historical background.

An interesting point supporting this point of view is that the Age of Pisces did not start at the orthodox birth of Christ but well over 100 BC. If the avatar of the age is supposed to come at the beginning of the age then Jesus would have missed it by some time if he was born at the orthodox date.

See below for an excerpt from Esoteric Christianity by Annie Besant who followed H. P. Blavatsky as President of the Theosophical Society.

Not all Theosophists and esoterists believe this approach. Rudolf Steiner thought that Blavatsky was deceived on the matter and Jesus was crucified April 3, 33 AD. He believed that Pandira was as forerunner of the real Christ.

Then there is the final possibility that seems to be accepted by Lucis Trust – that DK just made a mistake.

Here’s my thoughts on the matter. It is difficult to imagine that DK would have made such a black and white mistake such as this, especially when he had about thirty years to correct it before Alice A. Bailey’s death. One more mystery is why some student did not ask Bailey about it and then she could ask DK. We see no evidence of this happening. Maybe it did happen and we have no record. My logic would dictate that Apollonius was somehow linked to Jesus but at this point I do not have the full answer.

This may be a good exercise for the group. Read over this post and the writings below and contemplate and then give us your impressions.

From the writings of Annie Besant: “The thread of the life-story of Jesus is one which may be disentangled from those with which it is intertwined without any great difficulty. We may fairly here aid our study by reference to those records of the past which experts can reverify for themselves, and from which certain details regarding the Hebrew Teacher have been given to the world by H.P. Blavatsky and by others who are experts in occult investigation…

“The occult records partly endorse the story told in the Gospels, and partly do not endorse it; they show us the life, and thus enable us to disentangle it from the myths which are intertwined therewith.

“The child whose Jewish name has been turned into that of Jesus was born in Palestine B.C. 105, during the consulate of Publius Rutilius Rufus and Gnaeus Mallius Maximus. His parents were well-born though poor, and he was educated in a knowledge of the Hebrew Scriptures. His fervent devotion and a gravity beyond his years led his parents to dedicate him to the religious and ascetic life, and soon after a visit to Jerusalem, in which the extraordinary intelligence and eagerness for knowledge of the youth were shown in his seeking of the doctors in the Temple, he was sent to be trained in an Essene community in the southern Judaean desert. When he had reached the age of nineteen he went on to the Essene monastery near Mount Serbal, a monastery which was much visited by learned men travelling from Persia and India to Egypt, and where a magnificent library of occult works — many of them Indian of the Trans-Himalayan regions — had been established. From this seat of mystic learning he proceeded later to Egypt. He had been fully instructed in the secret teaching which were the real fount of life among the Essenes, and was initiated in Egypt as a disciple of that one sublime Lodge from which every great religion has its Founder. For Egypt has remained one of the world-centres of the true Mysteries, whereof all semi-public Mysteries are the faint and far-off reflections. The mysteries spoken of in history as Egyptian were the shadows of the true things “in the Mount,” and there the young Hebrew received the solemn consecration which prepared him for the royal priesthood he was later to attain. So superhumanly pure and so full of devotion was he, that in his gracious manhood he stood out pre-eminently from the severe and somewhat fanatical ascetics among whom he had been trained, shedding on the stern Jews around him the fragrance of a gentle and tender wisdom, as a rose-tree strangely planted in a desert would shed its sweetness on the barrenness around. The fair and stately grace of his white purity was round him as a radiant moonlit halo, and his words, though few, were ever sweet and loving, winning even the most harsh to a temporary gentleness, and the most rigid to a passing softness. Thus he lived through nine and twenty years of mortal life, growing from grace to grace.

“This superhuman purity and devotion fitted the man Jesus, the disciple, to become the temple of a loftier Power, of a mighty, indwelling Presence. The time had come for one of those Divine manifestations which from age to age are made for the helping of humanity, when a new impulse is needed to quicken the spiritual evolution of mankind, when a new civilization is about to dawn. The world of the West was then in the womb of time, ready for the birth, and the Teutonic sub-race was to catch the sceptre of empire failing from the failing hands of Rome. Ere it started on its journey a World-Saviour must appear, to stand in blessing beside the cradle of the infant Hercules.

“A mighty “Son of God” was to take flesh upon earth, a supreme Teacher, “full of grace and truth” — One in whom the Divine Wisdom abode in fullest measure, who was verily “the Word” incarnate, Light and Life in outpouring richness, a very Fountain of the Waters of Life. Lord of Compassion and of Wisdom, such was His name — from His dwelling in the Secret Places He came forth into the world of men.

“For Him was needed an earthly tabernacle, a human form, the body of a man, and who so fit to yield his body in glad and willing service to One before whom Angels and men bow down in lowliest reverence, as this Hebrew of the Hebrews, this purest and noblest of “the Perfect,” whose spotless body and stainless mind offered the best that humanity could bring? The man Jesus yielded himself a willing sacrifice, “offered himself without spot” to the Lord of Love, who took unto Himself that pure form as tabernacle, and dwelt therein for three years of mortal life.

“This epoch is marked in the traditions embodies in the Gospels as that of the Baptism of Jesus, when the Spirit was seen “descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him,” and a celestial voice proclaimed Him as the beloved Son, to whom men should give ear. Truly was He the beloved Son in whom the Father was well-pleased, and from that time forward “Jesus began to preach,” and was that wondrous mystery, “God manifest in the flesh” — not unique in that He was God, for: “Is it not written in your law, I said, ye are Gods? If he called them Gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken; say ye of Him, whom the Father hath sanctified and sent into the world, Thou blasphemist; because I said, I am the Son of god?” Truly all men are Gods, in respect to the Spirit within them, but not in all is the God-head manifested, as in that well-beloved Son of the Most High.

“To that manifested Presence the name of “the Christ” may rightly be given, and it was he who lived and moved in the form of the man Jesus over the hills and plains of Palestine, teaching, healing diseases, and gathering round Him as disciples a few of the more advanced souls. The rare charm of his royal love, outpouring form Him as rays from a sun, drew round Him the suffering, the weary, and the oppressed, and the subtly tender magic of His gentle wisdom purified, ennobled, and sweetened the lives that came into contact with His own. By parable and luminous imagery He taught the uninstructed crowds who pressed around Him, and, using the powers of the free Spirit, He healed many a disease by word or touch, reinforcing the magnetic energies belong to His pure body with the compelling force of His inner life. Rejected by the Essene brethren among whom He first laboured — whose arguments against His purposed life of loving labour are summarized in the story of the temptation — because he carried to the people the spiritual wisdom that they regarded as their proudest and most secret treasure, and because His all-embracing love drew within its circle the outcast and the degraded — ever loving in the lowest as in the highest, the Divine Self — He saw gathering clouds of hatred and suspicion. The teachers and rulers of His nation soon came to eye Him with jealousy and anger; His spirituality was a constant reproach to their materialism, His power a constant, though silent, exposure of their weakness. Three years had scarcely passed since His baptism when the gathering storm broke, and the human body of Jesus paid the penalty for enshrining the glorious Presence of a Teacher more than man.” From Esoteric Christianity, Or, The Lesser Mysteries, Annie Besant, Pages 126-135

“If at first you don’t succeed, then skydiving definitely isn’t for you.” Steven Wright

Sept 7, 2003

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

Log on to Freeread Here

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

Gather with JJ on Facebook HERE

Crème Connection, Part 4

Crème Connection, Part 4

Crème supporter: If someone who had never read a page of DK in their life were to read a complex page from Treatise on Cosmic Fire – they would not believe what DK is writing, they would not believe DK because they are using THEIR OWN (limited) knowledge to understand what DK writes. This is the problem of knowledge. The problem is that you can never have all of the facts, all knowledge. When you don’t have ALL of the facts you are left with belief, and this JJ, is what you have about Crème and what he is saying about the return of the World Teacher.

JJ: You’re making no sense. You criticize me for not having all the facts then you say we can never have all the facts.

When I first read DK back around 1967 I was ingrained in the Mormon Church. Everything he said went against what I believed, yet I only had to read a couple pages to realize that this was the most intelligent and enlightened writing I had ever come across. On the other hand, I’ve read hundreds of pages of Crème’s material and nothing similar to this happens. Crème actually had a foot in the door because he was talking about the return of Christ which was not against my belief system. There has to be some evidence of truth and high intelligence to keep the attention of any seeker. Instead, Crème, with his false predictions, gives powerful evidence he is wrong.

Reader’s response to my suggestion that he ask Crème if my quote from him was correct. “I will try to get personally in contact with him and ask these questions ….but i certainly won’t sign my name at the end of the letter because i realize as much as he will how ridiculous your questions are.”

JJ: You sound like a Mormon afraid to ask the prophet a question as he may be viewed as unfaithful. Be a man. Put your name on the letter.

JJ Quote >If Crème gives out a fixed date yet knows the date is fluid then what does>this mean? It means that Crème is consciously telling a bold faced lie by stating a>fixed time when he knows otherwise.

Reader: If Crème gives out a fixed date and knows the date is fluid, this is just another paradox of truth. Truth cannot be understood with the rational, analytical mind which you so often use. If Crème gives out a fixed date and knows the date is fluid – that MEANS he is giving out a fixed date which is fluid. Does that read like a riddle? Good. Yet another opportunity to realize truth.

JJ Congratulations!!! Most people have to live to at least the age of sixty to compile such a convoluted distortion of reality. You have done it at the young age of 21. It makes me curious as to how you will explain reality when you are 40! You’ll make Baghdad Bob look like Donny Osmond – or maybe Gandhi.

I should have thought of this reasoning when I was a teenager. I can just see it now.

Mom: You’re late! You said you’d be home by midnight and here it is 2 AM.

Young JJ: You do not understand. Your rational mind cannot understand midnight. Midnight is fluid and I knew this when I told you I would not be home at that hour. Because midnight is fluid this means that midnight is really 2 AM, or whatever time I get home. But the fluid thing worked didn’t it? You were sitting here waiting for me to arrive at midnight – weren’t you mom?

Mom: You lied to me and now have the audacity to insult me like this?

JJ: I’m not lying Mom. Midnight was fluid in my mind when I told you the time I would be home.

Mom: You may be fluid, but I’m not. You’re grounded for a month and there is no fluidity about it.

Woops. That didn’t work out so well. I guess the Crème doctrine would not have helped after all.

I could say Elijah came to your house yesterday. I’m telling the truth because “yesterday” is fluid in my mind. So is Elijah.

I think you deserve an award here for the most astounding doctrine that anyone has ever presented to the group.

Reader: Why must you need physical, worldly contact with Christ – … Like i said, it would be easier for you if you just let Him into your heart. If you invite Him into your life via your heart.

JJ: This is what the born-againers tell me every time I meet one. Like attracts like. Maybe if you read the Bible and attended the Baptist church you would feel right at home.

The reader then related all kinds of contacts and manifestations that Crème’s Maitreya was supposed to have made

JJ: Crème claims all kinds of manifestations which cannot be verified. For instance, he said Maitreya appeared to hundreds of Mormons in the west. If this had happened several Mormon scholars in the group would have heard about it, as nothing in Mormonism escapes them.

Reader: You have taught that DK stated that after 1975 revelatory teachings would be given out. This was fulfilled by Benjamin Crème.

JJ: No one including Crème has fulfilled the prophecy where the prediction was that the esoteric teachings would permeate society   through the media starting in 1975. You never hear Crème on the Radio or see him on TV. The world pretty much ignores him. DK was predicting a time that the esoteric teachings would reach humanity as much as the political talk shows and the religions do today. He was thinking of a time that all of us could turn on the media and on a certain station there would be an esoteric teacher reaching the masses. Unfortunately, the fulfillment of this prediction is behind schedule.

Comment from another reader: I also thought that where a person was evolution-wise was between them and their soul.

JJ: A person’s state of evolution is what it is. Whatever the person has achieved is what it is andf has nothing to do with what the soul or any other life says. What is between the person and the soul is what he does with the information on his point in evolution as he perceives it. A Master can discern can accurately discern the imitation status of regular humanity and the wise student can make a fairly accurate guess.

DK has taught (and I have elaborated on the fact) that the true disciple will not broadcast his point in evolution. Interestingly enough DK was an exception to this, but only after the fact that he was a Master was leaked out by accident.

A person’s Master also knows his point in evolution.

Also here is a principle.

The one of higher evolution can recognize one of equal or lower evolution, but the lower cannot discern with accuracy the higher.

The reader thinks that I should not have given my estimate of the status of various famous people since that approach brought some disagreement.

JJ Certain amount of group disagreement is desirable and inevitable being that I have a fourth ray mind. I am not alone in this fourth ray influence here. This conflict can cause members of the group to look in directions to which they were previously blind and lead some to harmony through conflict.

It is a good thing to analyze the achievers of humanity. The more we can understand them, the more we can also achieve and obtain power to serve.

Reader: And if JJ thinks Benjamin Crème has nothing to offer, why is he interested in Créme’s opinion about the vital statistics of these people?

JJ I never said he had nothing to offer, but even if I thought this way I would want to know what and how he thinks since we may be assisting a number of his students in the future. One must understand illusion in order to neutralize it.

That said, Crème does have a considerable knowledge base and has had much more free time in his life to study than I have had. When he speaks on esoteric philosophy you can rest assured that the teachings are from a brain that has studied and reflected. All his teachings are not incorrect.

The major thing to understand in relation to Crème’s teachings is the obvious fact that one as high up the status as the real Christ would know better than to give out several times the wrong exact dates for his appearance.

Reader: I wouldn’t have involved myself in the dialog the Crème supporter as I am not interested in watching a dog fight.

JJ: A much more accurate comparison would be the dialog, written and vocal, that the Founding Fathers had in voicing their differences of opinion. That which has been preserved for history has provoked much thought and been very useful and enlightening. Without the shadows cast by differences there is no vision in this physical world.

I would also choose the word “dialog” here rather than “fight.” Neither the Crème supporter or I see this as a fight nor an unfriendly confrontation. If I read him right he would be happy to have a beer with me and play some pool if he were nearby.

Reader: You say that the lower cannot accurately judge the higher so does this mean you think you are higher up than all on the list you gave?

The principle was in response to assessing live disciples which occurs when working with them. When one meets another seeker in person (or have extensive written communication), and they are of similar evolution then a recognition will occur. If one meets one who is higher but still has soul contact himself then he will realize he has met another with soul contact but will not be able to discern the higher processes going on in his consciousness though he may recognize that this person is further along on the path. The higher can discern the lower, however, even though the lower sometimes does not feel understood.

I was not discerning the status of historical figures through their vibration so no indication of my status is indicated. It was an academic exercise based on my knowledge of them. This can be done by anyone with esoteric knowledge. I do not have a clue to the status of the names on Crème’s list with whom I an not familiar, whether they be higher or lower than myself.

“The problem with the gene pool is that there is no lifeguard.” Steven Wright

Sept 4, 2003

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

Log on to Freeread Here

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

Gather with JJ on Facebook HERE