ACIM Conversations, Part 17

ACIM Conversations, Part 17
What is Forgiveness?

Student: I’ve been involved with some ACIM students over the subject of forgiveness and find their thoughts on it are all over the place. In your studies of the Course have you come across a definition that pins it down?

Teacher: First, let me ask you this. What is the definition of forgiveness as defined by the world?

Student: I’ll check with an online dictionary to see what it says. The Oxford dictionary seems to offer a concise definition as is commonly understood. It says it is when we “stop feeling angry or resentful toward someone for an offense, flaw, or mistake.”

Teacher: That seems to sum up the way most people perceive it. How are the students you are involved with seeing it different from this?

Student: Some really expand unrealistically on the idea. Like if I stub my toe on a rock then I am supposed to forgive the rock for the discomfort, or if there is bad weather I’m supposed to forgive it also. They say I’m supposed to forgive all kinds of inorganic things. That seems silly as I cannot see anything to forgive toward a rock or things that just get in the way.

Teacher: The problem is that the Course has expanded the meaning of forgiveness much beyond the standard definition. Since this is a core teaching in the Course it would have been helpful if it had given us a concise, easy to understand definition at the beginning of the text, but, as it is, one has to plow through the entire course to get a true impression of what it is really trying to say about the subject.

Student: You’ve studied it more than I have. What have you come up with?

Teacher: The Course just seems to assume that we know what forgiveness is, as if the standard definition would apply, but then it takes us into new territory without any redefining.

Student: You mean that you can’t find a definition of the word throughout the whole Course?

Teacher: There are all kinds of effects described that forgiveness is to produce but the closest specific definition is this passage

“To forgive is merely to remember only the loving thoughts you gave in the past, and those that were given you. All the rest must be forgotten.” T-17.III.1

Student: That is pretty much in harmony with the dictionary definition. If you have only loving thoughts, you will not be taking offense over what someone does. On the other hand, it doesn’t seem to apply to forgiving a rock for being in the way of my toe. I have no feelings positive or negative toward a rock in my path.

Teacher: But stubbing your toe may make you angry and that is not a loving thought.

Student: Yes, and this is where the Course seems to go beyond the regular meaning of the word.

Teacher: Yes, in normal understanding forgiveness only applies to offenses created by other human beings, but the Course has it applying to painful circumstances where individual humans are not involved. It even tells us we are to forgive the world. What do you suppose that means?

Student: I’m not sure. The world is not some entity that insults you. The regular definition does not apply there.

Teacher: But if we apply that definition I quoted from the Course one could say that a lot of things seem to happen in the world that produce unloving thoughts.

Student: So, if you are facing a disaster like a hurricane, one would find it pretty difficult to focus on only loving thoughts.

Teacher: It would, but perhaps that is what you would do at that time if you are successful in forgiving the world for the hurricane is a product of the world we made.

Student: In fact, most of my thoughts that are not loving are not caused by other people but by circumstances that just happen. I got fat tire the other day and was late to an important meeting. That made me vey angry. Who was I supposed to forgive – the tire?

Teacher: That may be part of what it means by forgiving the world, for that was an event manifested in it.

Student: But a flat tire out of the blue is much different than someone who attacks you with intent to do harm. I can’t find anything to forgive with the flat tire, but I admit that some people’s actions do affect me and I can see where forgiveness in the traditional sense may be in order there.

Teacher: Forgiveness as taught in ACIM is definitely not the traditional one, though it includes that.

Student: So, from your study of the Course how would you define the meaning of forgiveness as intended by its Author?

Teacher: The ACIM definition would include the dictionary definition you gave earlier and it appears that is what it is often talking about.

Student: How about summing up the ACIM non-dictionary definition?

Teacher: The Course tells us that this world of time and space is an illusion and does not even exist in the true reality. It also says that we cannot see two worlds but see either this world of illusion or the real one. So, putting all this together the Course seems to be telling us that true forgiveness is the application of true vision. To forgive the world and all that is in it one must see it as not existing and as having no real effect. When one does this, he will begin waking up

Student: I must still be asleep then because I would certainly attempt to get out of the way if a hurricane was headed my direction. I do not think I could just tell myself that it was an illusion that would have no effect.

Teacher: I have to admit that I probably would also, but do you recall how Jesus reacted when the ship he was on was threatened by a storm and his disciples thought they were going to die?

Student: He commanded the storm to be still and it went away.

Teacher: In ACIM language he forgave the storm. In other words, he saw it as something that did not exist in his waking reality so it did not exist. Do you recall another instance where his life seemed to be threatened?

Student: I’m not sure.

Teacher: Another time a mob from his home town tried to throw him off a cliff and he merely disappeared out of their midst. (See Luke 4:29-30)

Student: That would be so cool to have power. like that

Teacher: Indeed. The Course tells us that we will be invulnerable with a simple change of mind. We understand the theory behind the forgiveness as taught by the Course but applying it is something else. Do you know any of your fellow students who have forgiven the world to the extent that they have achieved invulnerability or have power to heal like Jesus did?

Student: Not really.

Teacher: We all have to work where we are, not where we are not. For most students it is a challenge just to forgive in the normal sense of the word so they can cast out all grievances and be at peace within themselves.

Student: So, is there a wrong way to forgive?

Teacher: Read this:

Student: “Forgiveness is not pity, which but seeks to pardon what it thinks to be the truth. Good cannot be returned for evil, for forgiveness does not first establish sin and then forgive it. Who can say and mean, “My brother, you have injured me, and yet, because I am the better of the two, I pardon you my hurt.” His pardon and your hurt cannot exist together. One denies the other and must make it false.” T-27.II.2

Teacher: So, what is the wrong approach according to that text?

Student: It appears that we need to avoid the attitude of superiority

Teacher: Read this to discover the correct approach.

Student: “Forgiveness recognizes what you thought your brother did to you has not occurred. It does not pardon sins and make them real. It sees there was no sin. And in that view are all your sins forgiven.” W-pII.1.1

Teacher: So, what is the difference between the incorrect and the correct approach?

Student: The wrong-headed approach is the one used by most religious people in that they see the sin in a brother and forgive because of their moral superiority. When the student has the right approach, he will see his brother as a Son of God as himself and see the mistake as an illusion that does not even exist in the true reality so there is nothing to forgive.

Teacher: I think we can assume that we must take this step, which is something we can believe we can achieve in this life, and when this happens the door to greater miracles that can manifest.

Student: Good advice that reminds me of one of my favorite sayings of Jesus. Let me read it to you:

“He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.” John 14:12

Teacher: The promise of doing even greater words than Jesus is quite profound. It should provide encouragement for all seekers of truth. Applying forgiveness to the best of our ability is a significant step in the right direction.

Links to The Mysteries of A Course in Miracles:

Read the Introduction HERE, Read Chapter One HERE. Chapter Two HERE, Chapter Three HERE, Chapter Four HERE, Chapter Five HERE Chapter Six HERE, Chapter Seven HERE, Chapter Eight HERE, Chapter Nine HERE, Chapter Ten HERE, Chapter Eleven HERE, Chapter Twelve HERE, Chapter Thirteen HERE, Chapter Fourteen HERE, Fifteen HERE, Sixteen HERE, Seventeen HERE,       Eighteen HERE, Nineteen HERE, Twenty HERE, Twenty-One HERE, Twenty-Two HERE, Twenty-Three HERE, Twenty-Four HERE, Twenty-Five HERE, Twenty-Six HERE, Twenty-Seven  HERE, Twenty-Eight  HERE, Twenty-Nine HERE, Thirty HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7, Part 8, Part 9, Part 10, Part 11, Part 12, Part 13, Part 14, Part 15, Part  16, Part 17, Part 18, Part 19, Part 20, Part 21, Part 22, Part 23, Part 24, Part 25

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

 

ACIM Conversations, Part 16

ACIM Conversations, Part 16
Managing Feelings About Ukraine

Student: Many Course students have been in a quandary lately about how to handle Putin. They think that he is not there, the war is not happening yet they cannot get beyond their feelings that they hate the guy and are greatly disturbed about the plight of the Ukrainians. I’d be interested in your views on the situation.

Teacher: What are your feelings about the situation?

Student: In the world we live in something is happening and my heart goes out to not only the Ukrainians who are suffering, but I’m sure many Russian soldiers are caught up in this thing against their will. I have very negative feelings toward Putin for what he has done.

Teacher: It is good that you are honestly facing your feelings for honesty is a key factor in obtaining liberation from the illusion. To pretend you are not affected by the war when you are is not being true to yourself and can take you further into the illusion. Consider this quote:

“The dreamer who doubts the reality of his dream while he is still dreaming is not really healing his split mind. You dream of a separated ego and believe in a world that rests upon it. This is very real to you. You cannot undo it by not changing your mind about it.” T-4.I.4

Student: So, how can I change my mind and stay at peace, as taught in the Course, with so many disturbing things happening in the world?

Teacher: There are two things I use to help me stay at peace during tempestuous times caused by out-of-control individuals. The first is something I call the Lion Principle.

Student: What in the world is that?

Teacher: We’ll get to that. Tell me, my friend, do you hate lions?

Student: Of course not.

Teacher: What do you think of them?

Student: They are powerful and respected. They are kind of like the royalty of the animal kingdom.

Teacher: Don’t you realize that if you were in the presence of one that is hungry you could be eaten alive?

Student: Of course.

Teacher: And are you aware that lions stalk innocent and weaker animals and eat them?

Student: Yes.

Teacher: Then why do you not hate them?

Student: I guess it is because that is just the nature of a lion and there’s nothing I can do about it.

Teacher: And Putin and other supposed bad guys are just following their nature as it exists in this world. How are they different from lions following their nature?

Student: Interesting comparison. So if I view Putin as a provoked lion I should just accept him as he is for that is his nature in this world and there is nothing I can do about it.

Teacher: Correct. There are many people we meet in life with undesirable characteristics that we could allow to disturb our peace, but if we use the Lion Principle, we realize that is just who they are and if we just accept that, as we do lions, then they no longer have power to disturb us.

Student: That may not be easy with some people I know.

Teacher: It is also helpful to not provoke the lions in your life and stay out of their way like you would a lion. Treat them like lions and they will have no more power to take away your peace than real lions.

Student: Sounds like good advice. What is the second method you use?

Teacher: The second is the Principle of the Observer. Consider this famous quote from Shakespeare:

“All the world’s a stage, And all the men and women merely players; They have their exits and their entrances, And one man in his time plays many parts.”

How do you see this relating to the teachings in the Course about this world being a dream?

Student: The Course calls this life a dream which means the mind is kind of acting out a drama for us that is not a part of real life – like a play.

Teacher: And if you acted in or just observed a play where people were suffering, does this cause you to suffer?

Student: No. I might imagine what it would feel like, but I would not actually suffer.

Teacher: Why not?

Student: Because I would just be an observer, not a participant.

Teacher: And here in this life, which is a like a play unfolding in the dream state, could you also be an observer and thus not allow events to disturb your peace?

Student: I would suppose so but it is easier said than done.

Teacher: It helps to change our minds about the dream to make what the Course calls “a happy dream.” We are given this advice:

“It is not difficult to change a dream when once the dreamer has been recognized. Rest in the Holy Spirit, and allow His gentle dreams to take the place of those you dreamed in terror and in fear of death.” T-27.VII.14

Until we can make all our dreams happy ones, taking the vantage point of the observer is a big help. It works for me.

Student: Does this mean I should take the attitude that nothing is happening as do some students?

Teacher: Not quite. Read this:

Student: “The body is merely part of your experience in the physical world. Its abilities can be and frequently are overevaluated. However, it is almost impossible to deny its existence in this world. Those who do so are engaging in a particularly unworthy form of denial.” T-2.IV.3

Teacher: Now this idea would apply to the world as well as the body. What is “a particularly unworthy form of denial?”

Student: To deny the existence of that which feels like it has a real existence. I would think it would also mean we should not deny the truth of how our bodies or this world affects us.

Teacher: Or maybe that we should not deny that the dreamlike play we are in is happening on some level. As the director of a play, you can be the observer, but still realize that the play is happening and you want to make the best of it. You cannot enjoy a play or movie with your eyes closed and ears plugged. You have to be aware of it but keep the attitude of the observer so the negative events will not disturb your peace.

Student: Good advice. I’ll work on incorporating the two principles.

Links to The Mysteries of A Course in Miracles:

Read the Introduction HERE, Read Chapter One HERE. Chapter Two HERE, Chapter Three HERE, Chapter Four HERE, Chapter Five HERE Chapter Six HERE, Chapter Seven HERE, Chapter Eight HERE, Chapter Nine HERE, Chapter Ten HERE, Chapter Eleven HERE, Chapter Twelve HERE, Chapter Thirteen HERE, Chapter Fourteen HERE, Fifteen HERE, Sixteen HERE, Seventeen HERE,       Eighteen HERE, Nineteen HERE, Twenty HERE, Twenty-One HERE, Twenty-Two HERE, Twenty-Three HERE, Twenty-Four HERE, Twenty-Five HERE, Twenty-Six HERE, Chapter Twenty-Seven  HERE, Chapter Twenty-Eight  HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7, Part 8, Part 9, Part 10, Part 11, Part 12, Part 13, Part 14, Part 15

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 15

ACIM Conversations, Part 15
Is There Duality in Heaven?

Student: I’ve been discussing duality with some students and they insist that the teachings in the Course on oneness prove that there is no duality in heaven.

Teacher: So, if there is no duality this would mean that there would be no such thing as more than one of anything. What do they say about the teaching that in heaven you have the Father, the Son, The Holy Spirit and angels? They add up to four, not one.

Student: They say that anything that seems to be dual is just presented that way for teaching purposes – that language cannot convey the truth.

Teacher: Sounds like they think that Jesus wasted a lot of time in transmitting the Course containing a half million words. Read this:

Student: “I have made every effort to use words that are almost impossible to distort, but it is always possible to twist symbols around if you wish.” T-3.I.3

Teacher: Note that Jesus said he made every attempt to communicate so clearly that it would be almost impossible to distort his words. Let us see what his words really said. Suppose heaven had no parts within it but just one lonely life. Would presenting heaven as consisting of the four lives – the Father, Son, Holy Spirit and angels represent an attempt at clarity?

Student: I’d say that would add to the confusion. If heaven had no duality and he wanted to be clear, as He says, then he should not have talked about the life of God as consisting of the four divisions.

Teacher: And we have already discussed how the Course teaches that the Sonship is composed of many parts.

Student: Yeah, if he were really trying to be clear then why would he speak of the Sons of God in the plural many times, if there is not more than one.

Teacher: Actually, proving duality to your friends should be quite easy for the evidence is overwhelming. First consider this. A complete non dual state would be one of nothingness and no existence at all. That is pretty much the view of the after-death state by the atheist. As long as there is life there is mind and mind has the power of decision as expressed here:

“The power of decision is our own. And we accept of Him that which we are, and humbly recognize the Son of God.” W-pI.152.10

So, how did we use the power of decision in a negative way, according to the Course?

Student: We decided to create a world where we could be separate from each other.

Teacher: Yes. Read this quote for additional light:

Student: “And what can think has choice, and can be shown that different thoughts have different consequence.” T-31.V.14

Teacher: Our thinking of separation certainly had a consequence, didn’t it?

Student: It indeed seems to have.

Teacher: If we have perfect freedom, as the Course teaches, and we think, and choice is always allowed then there must be more than one thing to choose from. Does that make sense?

Student: Yes. I understand we have the freedom to follow the will of God or not follow as we did in the separation.

Teacher: So we have established that there can be no such thing as choice without duality. Have you considered the Law of Cause and Effect which exists in heaven?

Student: Never thought about that, but cause and effect are two things and could only exist in duality.

Teacher: Read what the Course says about it.

Student: “If I intervened between your thoughts and their results, I would be tampering with a basic law of cause and effect; the most fundamental law there is.” T-2.VII.1

Teacher: This is the most fundamental law of all. We are told that God is the great cause in the universe, but what is the main effect He produces?

Student: The universe, I suppose.

Teacher: Close. Consider this quote: “Cause” is a term properly belonging to God, and His ‘Effect’ is His Son. This entails a set of Cause and Effect T-2.VII.3

Is a set one or two things?

Student: Two

Teacher: And I said you were close when saying the effect of God is the universe. Read this quote:

Student: “The universe consists of nothing but the Son of God,” W-pI.183.10

Wow. So saying the effect of God is the universe and the Son is saying the same thing.

Teacher: Would you say cause and effect is one thing or two?

Student: The Course seems to call then a set or two.

Teacher: In a non-dual universe there could not be more than one life or parts, but there also could be no differences. But to the contrary the Course tells us that there are differences between the four types of lives in heaven. Check out this passage:

Student: “I and my Father are one, but there are two parts to the statement in recognition that the Father is greater.” T-1.II.4

Teacher: In a non-dual universe could one life be greater than another?

Student: No.

Teacher: Now check out this verse:

Student: “You were created ABOVE the angels because your role involves creation as well as protection. You who are in the image of the Father need bow only to HIM, before whom I kneel with you.” UR T 1 B 30y

Interesting. Just as the Father is greater than the Son, the Son is above the angels with a different function

Teacher: Yes the Son’s function is to create and that of the angels is for protection. In a non-dual universe would the two have different jobs?

Student: That wouldn’t be possible.

Teacher: The fourth life is the Holy Spirit who also has a job. Read it here:

Student: “The Holy Spirit mediates higher to lower communication, keeping the direct channel from God to you open for revelation.” T-1.II.5

Teacher: Would you say that is a different job than held by the Father, the Son or angels?

Student: Yes. This definitely shows there is some dualism in heaven.

Teacher: In addition, we are told that there are three tools used by the Father and the Son. The first is ideas. The Course says “Ideas are of the mind.” and “every idea begins in the mind of the thinker.” T-26.VII.4 & T-6.III.1

Obviously there exists more than one idea in the mind of God. What do you suppose the second is?

Student: Your quote mentions mind.

Teacher: Good. And the third is Spirit. This passage speaks of them both.

Student: “Only the mind is capable of error.” T-2.IV.2 “It is essential to remember that only the mind can create, and that correction belongs at the thought level. To amplify an earlier statement, spirit is already perfect and therefore does not require correction.” T-2.V.1

Teacher: We are told the mind is capable of error. Would this be possible if all reality were pure non dualistic?

Student: I wouldn’t think so.

Teacher: And what is the function of the mind?

Student: To create

Teacher: And how is Spirit different from mind?

Student: It is perfect – apparently incapable of error.

Teacher: In addition, we are told that “Spirit makes use of mind as means to find its Self expression.” W-pI.96.3.

So, what do you think? Do these three tools that God uses illustrate dualism or non-dualism?

Student: The three with different functions definitely show us dualism is involved.

Teacher: We’ve already discussed the idea that there are many parts to the Son, but we are also told that each as a unique place in the plan. Read this:

Student: “You are altogether irreplaceable in the Mind of God. No one else can fill your part in it, and while you leave your part of it empty your eternal place merely waits for your return.” T-9.VIII.10

Teacher: It plainly states that each of us has a part to play in our heavenly home that “no one else can fill.” Does that uniqueness sound like no duality to you?

Student: Hardly. It sounds like billions of us have a unique contribution to make.

Teacher: Why do you suppose that so many ACIM students believe there is no dualism in heaven?

Student: I suppose that it is because the Course places such emphasis on the oneness of God and all life

Teacher: Yet you believe in dualism in heaven, but you also believe in the oneness of life. How is your thinking different from the non-dualism group?

Student: They think that oneness means one life only with no parts whereas I see oneness as many unified parts joined together participating in the life of the whole.

Teacher: Would you think the life of God is a little like the life of our body which is one but composed of trillions of cells each having their own life?

Student: Yeah, maybe the creation of the body is a shadow reflection of the life of God. In fact, Paul in the Bible compares God and Christ to a body.

Teacher: Read this next passage telling us what our function is:

Student: “Be happy, for your only function here is happiness.” W-pI.102.5 “God’s world is happy. Those who look on it can only add their joy to it, and bless it as a cause of further joy in them.” W-pII.301.2

Teacher: Now tell me this. Which version of God would be happier; one that is all alone or one who shares with billions of unified lives, or Sons?

Student: I can’t imagine God being happy being all alone.

Teacher: Neither can he. Read this:

Student: “God is lonely without His Sons, and they are lonely without Him.” T-2.III.5 “He is lonely when the minds He created do not communicate fully with Him.” T-4.VII.6

Wow. That pretty much says it.

Teacher: Now visualize yourself being God, creator of all there is, but you have no one with which to share. Can you imagine being happy?

Student: Not really. That would be the greatest of all hells. I cannot imagine being in a state of happiness without sharing.

Teacher: Neither can God.

Links to The Mysteries of A Course in Miracles:

Read the Introduction HERE, Read Chapter One HERE. Chapter Two HERE, Chapter Three HERE, Chapter Four HERE, Chapter Five HERE Chapter Six HERE, Chapter Seven HERE, Chapter Eight HERE, Chapter Nine HERE, Chapter Ten HERE, Chapter Eleven HERE, Chapter Twelve HERE, Chapter Thirteen HERE, Chapter Fourteen HERE, Fifteen HERE, Sixteen HERE, Seventeen HERE,       Eighteen HERE, Nineteen HERE, Twenty HERE, Twenty-One HERE, Twenty-Two HERE, Twenty-Three HERE, Twenty-Four HERE, Twenty-Five HERE, Twenty-Six HERE, Chapter Twenty-Seven  HERE, Chapter Twenty-Eight  HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7, Part 8, Part 9, Part 10, Part 11, Part 12, Part 13, Part 14

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

 

ACIM Conversations, Part 14

ACIM Conversations, Part 14
Where Did God Come From?

The following represents a realistic, but fictionalized discussion, between A Course in Miracles student and a more seasoned one we label “teacher,” designed to reveal the truth behind some of the more obscure teachings of ACIM

Student: I’ve got a question I’ll bet you can’t answer. Where did God come from?

Teacher: That is the great mystery, but another question just as intriguing is how is it that anything exists, including God?

Student: I recall the Course stating merely that “God Is” but that doesn’t tell us why or how God is.

Teacher: But the Course tells us more than you might suppose. Read this:

Student: “God is an idea, and so your faith in Him is strengthened by sharing. What you find difficult to accept is the fact that, like your Father, you are an idea.” T-15.VI.4

Teacher: So, what does this tell us about God?

Student: It says that God is an idea. Seems like an odd statement.

Teacher: And what does it say about us?

Student: It says that we are also ideas, like our Father, God.

Teacher: Now read what the Course says about ideas:

Student: “Ideas leave not their source, and their effects but seem to be apart from them. Ideas are of the mind.” T-26.VII.4  “He created you as part of Him, and this must still be true because ideas leave not their source.” T-26.VII.13

Teacher: We are told that we are ideas and ideas do not leave their source. What is our source?

Student: That would be God for he created us as the verse says.

Teacher: And God is also an idea so the big question is, what is His source?

Student: Are you saying that God has a source of creation as we do?

Teacher: I’m just going by what the Course says. But it does seem to say God was created.

Student: This I’ve got to see. Where is that reference?

Teacher: Read this:

Student: “Your will to create was given you by your Creator, Who was expressing the same Will IN HIS CREATION.” T-2.VIII.1

Teacher: Who’s creation is the verse talking about?

Student: Our Creator.

Teacher: And who is our creator?

Student: God

Teacher:  And God is an idea with a creation and a source. What is that source of ideas?

Student: You got me.

Teacher: You were told in the verse we just read. Here read it again:

Student: “Ideas are of the mind.” T-26.VII.4

Teacher: Let us summarize what we have gathered so far. You are an idea who has not left its source, which is God. But God is also similarly a creation and an idea who has not left His source. Finally, the source of all ideas is “the mind.” Is it possible that some type of universal mind created the idea that we call God?

Student: If God is a creation and an idea then something had to create him.

Teacher: To shed further light we must ask this question. What is God?

Student: I’ve always just thought He was the creator of all things, but since the Course says he had a creation – now I am not sure.

Teacher: In an earlier discussion we talked about the purpose of the Son. What was that?

Student: To create like the Father.

Teacher: And what does he create?

Student: More Sons.

Teacher: And when a Son creates a Son what relationship does he have to his creation?

Student: I suppose he becomes a father to the new Son.

Teacher: And read again what your Father does for you

Student: “He extends His Fatherhood to you so that you can extend yourself AS HE DID. You do not understand this because you do not understand Him.” T-8.VI.6

Teacher: So when you extend yourself as your Father did what do you do?

Student: Fulfill my function of creating additional Sons.

Teacher: Think on this. Your Sons will call you Father, Is it not logical that your Father, who created Sons, also has a Father and is himself a Son?

Student: That would seem to be a logical conclusion. So, is God just a created Son then?

Teacher: Remember God is an idea. So, what is the idea we are talking about here?

Student: It seems to be an eternal chain of Fathers and Sons.

Teacher: Yes, and that eternal chain of Fathers and Sons is the idea that we call God. And what is the source of that idea?

Student: We are told it is mind.

Teacher: Therefore, if we follow the Course’s teachings the closest we can come to the origin of all things is mind, or perhaps intelligence would be a good alternative word.

Student: So where does mind come from?

Teacher: The Course doesn’t give us a hint on this, but it does say “If I did not think I would not exist, because life is thought.” W-pI.54.2.

Therefore, without mind neither God nor the Sons could even exist. To go further in understanding you must tap into universal mind yourself wherein lies the answer to all things.

Links to The Mysteries of A Course in Miracles:

Read the Introduction HERE, Read Chapter One HERE. Chapter Two HERE, Chapter Three HERE, Chapter Four HERE, Chapter Five HERE Chapter Six HERE, Chapter Seven HERE, Chapter Eight HERE, Chapter Nine HERE, Chapter Ten HERE, Chapter Eleven HERE, Chapter Twelve HERE, Chapter Thirteen HERE, Chapter Fourteen HERE, Fifteen HERE, Sixteen HERE, Seventeen HERE,       Eighteen HERE, Nineteen HERE, Twenty HERE, Twenty-One HERE, Twenty-Two HERE, Twenty-Three HERE, Twenty-Four HERE, Twenty-Five HERE, Twenty-Six HERE, Chapter Twenty-Seven  HERE, Chapter Twenty-Eight  HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7, Part 8, Part 9, Part 10, Part 11, Part 12, Part 13

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 13

ACIM Conversations, Part 13
Should I Support Improving the World?

Student: There has been a lot of conversation among students lately about the war in Ukraine and other world problems. Some of them seem to want to ignore problems in the world, and sometimes even their personal lives, saying that the world is an illusion and has not even happened so just be at peace and see the situation as unreal as if it is not even there. That sounds a little cold to me. What is your take on this?

Teacher: Let us suppose that you were driving down the road and a child runs out into the street in front of you. Do you put on the brakes to avoid killing the kid or do you just say to yourself, “This is a dream that is not happening? I need do nothing.”

Student: I would think you would have to be insane to not put on the brakes.

Teacher: Yet, perhaps you have encountered those who think we are insane for thinking to do anything in the world to make it better.

Student: Yes, I have encountered some who seem to think this way. I find it disturbing.

Teacher: Yet, you cannot blame those who see in black and white, for the Course does say that “Nothing that you see means anything.” W-pI.7.1 and the world “is not there at all.” T-20.III.5

Student: Yes, and if you take that plus the nothing has happened idea too far then one would have no motivation to do anything to prevent harm.

Teacher: Let us be real here. Do you know any hard-core literalists who would not apply the brakes to avoid hitting a child or to assuage themselves with peace and do nothing if a loved one was being raped in front of their eyes?

Student: I think that those people would be supporting a more common view in situations like that.

Teacher: So, why do you suppose the Course places such emphasis on the nonreality of this world?

Student: I guess the idea is to present the final solution of the separation to us so students will be focused on seeking the spiritual rather than the material world of illusion.

Teacher: Good conclusion, but we must ask this question. What is the final state that we are asked to achieve?

Student: First, we are to change our thinking so we will see the real world, or this world correctly perceived, and finally we awaken and this world disappears.

Teacher: And what did Jesus say to Helen happened to his body when he awakened?

Student: I’m not sure.

Teacher: Read this quote:

Student: “My body disappeared because I had no illusion about it. The last one had gone. It was laid in the tomb, but there was nothing left to bury.” From “Special Messages”, by Jesus through Helen Schuchman.

Teacher: Again, what happened to his body when he awakened?

Student: His body disappeared.

Teacher: Then if you read the rest of the text you’ll see that he was able to make his body appear and disappear at will. It would be cool to have that kind of power wouldn’t it?

Student: Indeed. I can see why one would be fearless if one did.

Teacher: Do any of your fellow students who keep proclaiming that nothing matters because nothing we see is real have this power to make their bodies disappear and reappear at will?

Student: Definitely not.

Teacher: Why not, since they say that our bodies are not even here? Why cannot they not demonstrate that which they claim to be a reality?

Student: I’m not sure. Maybe they do not believe strongly enough.

Teacher: It goes deeper than that. Consider this from the Course: “It is impossible to see two worlds which have no overlap of any kind. Seek for the one; the other disappears. But one remains.” W-pI.130.5

Which world are you seeing at this moment?

Student: I suppose I am seeing the world of the dream.

Teacher: And what would happen if you saw the spiritual world instead?

Student: This one would disappear according to your quote.

Teacher: Kind of like what happened to the body of Jesus when he was fully awake?

Student: That seems to be the teaching.

Teacher: Have any of your friends who say they and the world are not here had their bodies disappear and have left behind all perception of the world?

Student: Definitely not. They still perceive me and our bodies.

Teacher: As we mentioned, the Course was given to us to guide us back to spirit. How long do you think this journey will take?

Student: I’m not sure, but I do know that I am not there yet.

Teacher: Read this passage which may shed some light:

Student: “the separation occurred over millions of years, the Last Judgment will extend over a similarly long period, and perhaps an even longer one.” T-2.VIII.2

Teacher: So how long did it take us to get here at this point?

Student: Millions of years.

Teacher: Actually, Helen’s original notes said “many millions.” And how long will the return process take?

Student: As long or longer than it did to get here. I can see now why there has to be reincarnation as Helen believed.

Teacher: Yes, it will take a while, for even though individuals may awaken, the Course tells us the whole Sonship will not be fully in heaven until all awaken and return. Consider this passage: “As long as a single “slave” remains to walk the earth, your release is not complete. Complete restoration of the Sonship is the only goal of the miracle-minded.” T-1.VII.3

The purpose of the Course is to speed up the process of return. Now let me ask you this. Let us say that instead of looking at many millions of years for your return to happen that you could achieve it in a dozen more lifetimes spanning just a couple thousand years. Would you say it is worthwhile to make an effort to improve the conditions of those lifetimes so you and others could have the “happy dream” rather than one that resembles a nightmare?

Student: I’d say it would be worthwhile effort for even one lifetime.

Teacher: Perhaps the greatest example given to us as to how to handle the pain of the world was given by Jesus himself, as related in the New Testament. The scriptures tell us plainly that Jesus worked tirelessly to relieve the pain the people. He caused the lame to walk, the deaf to hear, the blind to see and cured many diseases. When he approached a suffering soul did he ever tell them their problem was not happening and because nothing was happening he did nothing?

Student: No. He worked actively to assist them.

Teacher: Did he ever tell them to not worry about their problem because there were not even there?

Student: Ha ha. Now you’re being funny, but it didn’t seem funny when I hear Course students ay such things.

Teacher: Do you recall the first miracle performed by Jesus?

Student: Yes. That was when he turned the water into wine. That was one of my favorites.

Teacher: They were having a large wedding feast at Cana and they unexpectedly ran out of wine. Everyone was in a great mood and they expected the wine to continue to flow. If it did not the mood would have been spoiled and what was supposed to be a great memory would have been tarnished. Would you say that this miracle improved the quality of the experience for the wedding guests?

Student: Definitely.

Teacher: Now let us use a correspondence here and imagine this group as representative of the world as a whole. If students could make the lives of the world as a whole a happier experience – as did Jesus with a group – would that be a good thing?

Student: I would think so.

Teacher: It is indeed true that when any experience in time ends, whether it be an hour of a million years, it may just seem like an instant when it is over, but when we are in the dream even a few years of pain seems like forever. Because we are obviously seeing this world of illusion and subject to time does it not make sense to do what we can to make life here a pleasant experience for ourselves and others?

Student: Yes. That reminds me of the story by Jesus of the Good Samaritan. A man was attacked by thieves and left for dead. Two pious religious ones ignored him and felt spiritually justified in doing so, but a third, a Samaritan, who was generally considered an enemy by the Jews, stopped to help. This was an example that we are supposed to follow.

Teacher: Yea. Be funny if one of those who didn’t help thought to himself, “This is a dream and that man is not even there.”

Student: Yeah, it would be funny, but not funny. So, if we follow the example of Jesus and do what we can to relieve pain and make the world a better place how then do we handle the injunctions from the Course about seeing the world as if it does not exist?

Teacher: This quotation by the Course from Jesus reveals a lot:

“I must understand uncertainty and pain, although I know they have no meaning. Yet a savior must remain with those he teaches, seeing what they see, but still retaining in his mind the way that led him out, and now will lead you out with him. God’s Son is crucified until you walk along the road with me.” W-pI.rV.in.6

So what does this verse tell us should be the attitude of those who want to be teachers or saviors of others?

Student: It says they “must understand uncertainty and pain” of others who are in the dream.

Teacher: And if he understands will he tell the afflicted to get over it because it is not happening?

Student: That wouldn’t be helpful.

Teacher: But even though a teacher may understand the pain he can see the world as an illusion and escape the pain for himself and eventually lead others to the place of peace. In the process this can happen:

“His Word assures us that He loves the world. God’s Word has promised that peace is possible here, and what He promises can hardly be impossible.” M-11.1

Then this passage is beautifully written:

“Peace now belongs here, because a Thought of God has entered. What else but a Thought of God turns hell to Heaven merely by being what it is? The earth bows down before its gracious Presence, and it leans down in answer, to raise it up again. Now is the question different. It is no longer, ‘Can peace be possible in this world?’ but instead, ‘Is it not impossible that peace be absent here?’” M-11.4

Student: I love that and I love the idea of making the earth a better place whether it be for a few years, a lifetime or many lifetimes.

Teacher: Yes, we all have dreams, but good dreams are so much more pleasant than nightmares. Since we have free will let us go with the good dreams while we are here.

Links to The Mysteries of A Course in Miracles:

Read the Introduction HERE, Read Chapter One HERE. Chapter Two HERE, Chapter Three HERE, Chapter Four HERE, Chapter Five HERE Chapter Six HERE, Chapter Seven HERE, Chapter Eight HERE, Chapter Nine HERE, Chapter Ten HERE, Chapter Eleven HERE, Chapter Twelve HERE, Chapter Thirteen HERE, Chapter Fourteen HERE, Fifteen HERE, Sixteen HERE, Seventeen HERE,       Eighteen HERE, Nineteen HERE, Twenty HERE, Twenty-One HERE, Twenty-Two HERE, Twenty-Three HERE, Twenty-Four HERE, Twenty-Five HERE, Twenty-Six HERE, Chapter Twenty-Seven  HERE, Chapter Twenty-Eight  HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7, Part 8, Part 9, Part 10, Part 11, Part 12

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

 

ACIM Conversations, Part 12

ACIM Conversations, Part 12

The Eternal Idea

Student: Last time we talked about the fascinating teaching calling the separation “an instant that is relived again and again and still again.” M-2.3 & 4 We concluded that it is not the same Sons who are doing this but it fulfilled the desire of the newly created Sons wanting to have the experience. Does this mean that the separation will never be completely healed?

Teacher: Yes and no.

Student: Why am I not surprised that the answer is not simple?

Teacher: It is simple once it is understood. Let us first review an important principle taught in the Course. Do you recall that it teaches that the purpose of the Son is to create?

Student: Yes.

Teacher: And that which the Son creates are more Sons which expands the real universe itself?

Student: Yes, I found that an interesting teaching that the Course plainly teaches but went over my head.

Teacher: And here is the crucial question. How long do the creations of the Son last?

Student: I believe it is eternity.

Teacher: Correct. Read again the passage we ended with in our last discussion

Student: “What God and His Sons create is eternal” T-8.VI.3 and “The circle of creation has no end.” T-28.II.1

Teacher: On the other hand, all things in this world of form, time and space are not eternal but will have an end. Read this:

Student: “The stars will disappear, and night and day will be no more. All things that come and go, the tides, the seasons and the lives of men; all things that change with time and bloom and fade will not return. Where time has set an end is not where the eternal is.” T-29.VI.2

Teacher: So, even the sun and the stars which last billions of years will someday have an end. All things will eventually end in this world, even the universe itself. If this is the case, how could it be created by the Son when all that the Son creates is eternal?

Student: Good question. I guess we are to believe the Son went temporarily insane, split his mind and in his wrong mind created this world of illusion.

Teacher: And what is the difference between the world of illusion and the eternal world?

Student: Everything in this world has a beginning and an end while everything in heaven is eternal

Teacher: And because everything in time and space will have an end and be as if it never was, the Course sometimes refers to this world as something that does not exist, but even a temporary dream has an existence, just not an existence in the waking world. Read these quotes:

Student: “Here the world of idols has been set by the idea this power and place and time are given form, and shape the world where the impossible has happened.” T-29.VIII.6 “Truth and illusions both are equal now, for both have happened. The impossible becomes the thing you need forgiveness for, salvation from.” W-pI.99.2

Teacher: So what happened?

Student: The impossible.

Teacher: And what is that?

Student: I suppose it is the creation or making of this temporary world of illusion

Teacher: And why is it called impossible?

Student: Because what the Son creates is supposed to be eternal and all things in this world are not eternal and will have an end.

Teacher: Since it is impossible for the Son, who is like the Father, to create anything that is not eternal then how could that which is temporary also be eternal?

Student: You got me there. That doesn’t sound possible.

Teacher: Yet it is possible. Do you remember what the Course called the separation in the beginning?

Student: It called it “a mad idea.”

Teacher: And can an idea be destroyed?

Student: I suppose it can be put aside, but I would have to say that you cannot destroy it

Teacher: And the Course affirms this. It says, “my words make perfect sense because they come from God. They are as sensible now as they ever were, because they speak of ideas that are eternal.” T-9.IV.4

We are told that this mad idea first surfaced in a past so ancient that it is beyond the reach of any memory, but here we are still talking about it. Is this not proof that even a mad idea is eternal?

Student: It would seem so.

Teacher: So the Son who can only create the eternal gets the mad idea to create that which is not eternal. Again, I ask how can that which is not eternal be eternal?

Student: You tell me.

Teacher: No. You tell me after you read again the quote from the beginning of our conversation.

Student: (He reads that the mad idea is) “an instant that is relived again and again and still again.” M-2.3 & 4

Teacher: So how can that which is not eternal be eternal?

Student: I think I finally see it. All ideas of the Son are eternal and the idea to create the temporary is also eternal if the temporary is created “again and again and still again.”

Teacher: And who is it that would desire to enter into the dreamworld again?

Student: The newly created Sons.

Teacher: The time will come when all the stars and the whole universe will be no more. Does this mean that the idea behind the universe of time and space is no more?

Student: The idea would still be there.

Teacher: And would there be anything stopping a group of all powerful Sons from manifesting it again, if they desired?

Student: I suppose not.

Teacher: And on a miniature scale let me ask you this. Do you just have one dream during one night or do you have many dreams over many nights?

Student: Many dreams.

Teacher: And correspondingly would the Sons of God just have one dream and wake up with no Sons ever having a dream again?

Student: What you’re saying does make sense. Various Sons create a dream like this world “again and again and still again,” for an idea is eternal and cannot be destroyed.

Teacher: So that which is temporary can be eternal if it repeats forever- as the Course  says “The circle of creation has no end.” T-28.II.1

Student: I can see now that all things the Son creates is eternal just as the Course says. It is like an eternal round or circle of creation. This is fascinating to contemplate.

Links to The Mysteries of A Course in Miracles:

Read the Introduction HERE, Read Chapter One HERE. Chapter Two HERE, Chapter Three HERE, Chapter Four HERE, Chapter Five HERE Chapter Six HERE, Chapter Seven HERE, Chapter Eight HERE, Chapter Nine HERE, Chapter Ten HERE, Chapter Eleven HERE, Chapter Twelve HERE, Chapter Thirteen HERE, Chapter Fourteen HERE, Fifteen HERE, Sixteen HERE, Seventeen HERE,       Eighteen HERE, Nineteen HERE, Twenty HERE, Twenty-One HERE, Twenty-Two HERE, Twenty-Three HERE, Twenty-Four HERE, Twenty-Five HERE, Twenty-Six HERE, Chapter Twenty-Seven  HERE, Chapter Twenty-Eight  HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7, Part 8, Part 9, Part 10, Part 11

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

 

ACIM Conversations, Part 11

ACIM Conversations, Part 11
The Four Groups of Sons

Student: We have dispelled the idea that we are just watching a rerun of our lives (See Part 9) and discussed the Course’s meaning when it refers to the one Son or Sonship. But in connection with this many believe that the Course teaches that every move we make is predestined like every frame in a movie projector is already filmed and nothing can change the next scene to be projected.

Teacher: What do you think of that idea?

Student: It just doesn’t sound right to me, especially considering that the Course teaches we will not have memories of this illusion when we return, and it will be to us as if this dream never happened just like our dreams at night. Why would we recall to memory that which is no longer remembered?

Teacher: Good question. Why do you suppose that many think we are reliving memories when we are told we will have no memories?

Student: From my studies the Course appears to teach it both ways. It says we will have no memories yet it also says we are here reliving memories.

Teacher: Let us take a look at a passage that talks about reliving the past. Here is one:

“Time really, then, goes backward to an instant so ancient that it is beyond all memory, and past even the possibility of remembering. Yet because it is an instant that is relived again and again and still again, it seems to be now… The world of time is the world of illusion. What happened long ago seems to be happening now. Choices made long since appear to be open; yet to be made. What has been learned and understood and long ago passed by is looked upon as a new thought, a fresh idea, a different approach.” M-2.3 & 4

This does sound like we are reliving a very ancient instant “again and again and still again.”

Student: Yeah, it makes it sound like we are in the movie Groundhog Day. In our past discussion we talked about how illogical it would be to relieve a nightmare once, but here it makes it sound like we are reliving the same one, not once but many times. As for me I want to move on from my painful past experiences, not relive them endlessly.

Teacher: Can you conceive of how this quote we gave about reliving the past could be in harmony with your instinct about not choosing to relive a painful past?

Student: Sorry. I can’t. It sounds insane that any Son would voluntarily choose to relive a nightmare “again and again and still again.”

Teacher: Yes, it would be insane. Who wants to relieve even a good day over and over?

Student: Good point. I’m all ears regarding your explanation.

Teacher: To understand this conundrum we have to recall the meaning of the Son or Sonship that we discussed earlier. You will recall that we agreed that the Son represents one great life, but with many parts called the “Sons of God.”

Student: Yes

Teacher: And did all the Sons enter the illusion?

Student: No. Part stayed in heaven.

Teacher: Have you noticed that when the Course talks about something that part of the Sonship does it speaks as if the whole Sonship is doing it?

Student: Yes. Sometimes it seems to be speaking to just me, or maybe to Helen, but I could see that it applied to the whole Sonship.

Teacher: Would you say that it makes sense that the action or thought of the part affects the whole?

Student: Seems to. After all, the Course tells us that the separation “shattered heaven.”

Teacher: Did you realize that there are four groups of Sons within the Sonship? We previously discussed two which were the Sons who never left heaven and the Sons who separated. Do you remember a third?

Student: Apparently there are some who separated and then awakened and are fully in heaven. You say there is a fourth group? Who would that be?

Teacher: New Sons, or Sons created after the initial separation.

Student: Wow! That is an interesting statement but I do not recall reading about new Sons.

Teacher: You have to take what the Course says and add 2+2 to equal 4. Tell me what does the Course say the purpose of the Sonship is?

Student: I guess to be one and live in joy and peace.

Teacher: It’s more than that. Here read these two quotes:

Student: “You were created only to create” T-14.I.4 “His joy lay in creating you, and He extends His Fatherhood to you so that you can extend yourself AS HE DID. You do not understand this because you do not understand Him.” T-8.VI.6

Teacher: So, what is the purpose of the Sonship?

Student: To create like the Father.

Teacher: Yes and even the Bible in John, chapter one, we are told that Christ, another name for the Sonship, created all things. Now tell me this. What is it that the Son creates as the Father did?

Student: The Universe

Teacher: Now read this:

Student: “There is no end to God and His Son, for we are the universe… See His creations as His Son” T-11.I.5

Teacher: Here we see that the Son is synonymous with the universe itself. It says, “The universe consists of nothing but the Son of God, who calls upon his Father.” W-pI.183.10 Again I ask what is it that the Son creates as the Father did?

Student: More Sons.

Teacher: Exactly. Now read this:

Student: “A co-creator with the Father must have a Son. Yet must this Son have been created like Himself.” T-24.III.6 “You are part of God, as your sons are part of His Sons.” T-7.I.3

Teacher: So when the Son creates what does he produce?

Student: More Sons just like the Father.

Teacher: In fact, the Course tells us that we will attain to the position of fatherhood. read this:

Student: “Without your Father you will not know your fatherhood. The Kingdom of God includes all His Sons AND THEIR CHILDREN, who are as like the Sons as they are like the Father.” T-7.XI.7

Wow. This is quite a teaching. How did I miss this?

Teacher: We tend to remember what fits in with our current belief system. Now is the time to add 2+2 and see what we come up with. We are told that the initial separation occurred in a past so ancient that it is beyond memory but Sons still want to access this dreamworld and relive it. We concluded that Sons who have awakened would have no desire to do this since they view it as a nightmare compared to heaven. But there is a fourth group of Sons in heaven who may be curious as to what it would be like to enter the dream. And who might they be?

Student: The Sons who were created after the initial separation. This is fascinating. I think I see where you are going.

Teacher: And kids are always curious aren’t they? Since all things are accessible to all Sons the newly created sons would become aware of the separation that the parents experienced. Even if the parents told them that it was a nightmare their curiosity would still remain. What do you think? Does adding 2+2 tell you that some of them decided to relive the dream, but on their own terms?

Student: That does make a lot of sense when you think about it.

Teacher: Since creation is eternal then the new Sons would have additional Sons and they also would be curious and some of these would want to experience the dream

Student: A light just went off in my head! I can see what the passage means that says the Sonship is reliving the separation “again and again and still again.” It is not individual Sons who have awakened who are doing this, but newly created Sons and later their Sons and then their Sons and so on.

Teacher: So on for how long?

Student: Who knows? Maybe eternity.

Teacher: After all, it is written that “What God and His Sons create is eternal” T-8.VI.3 and “The circle of creation has no end.” T-28.II.1

Student: I’ll tell you this. You have certainly gave me a lot to think about today

Teacher: There more to come. Prepare yourself.

Links to The Mysteries of A Course in Miracles:

Read the Introduction HERE, Read Chapter One HERE. Chapter Two HERE, Chapter Three HERE, Chapter Four HERE, Chapter Five HERE Chapter Six HERE, Chapter Seven HERE, Chapter Eight HERE, Chapter Nine HERE, Chapter Ten HERE, Chapter Eleven HERE, Chapter Twelve HERE, Chapter Thirteen HERE, Chapter Fourteen HERE, Fifteen HERE, Sixteen HERE, Seventeen HERE,       Eighteen HERE, Nineteen HERE, Twenty HERE, Twenty-One HERE, Twenty-Two HERE, Twenty-Three HERE, Twenty-Four HERE, Twenty-Five HERE, Twenty-Six HERE, Chapter Twenty-Seven  HERE, Chapter Twenty-Eight  HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7, Part 8, Part 9, Part 10

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

 

ACIM Conversations, Part 10

ACIM Conversations, Part 10
The Meaning Behind the Son

Student: I am interested in your thoughts concerning the seemingly contrary statements in the Course talking about how the separation is over, and then sounding as if it is not over. I haven’t heard anyone come close to explaining that to my satisfaction.

Teacher: I have some thoughts on this that may shed some light. Allow me to ask a few questions. They may not seem related at first but hopefully we’ll tie them together.

Student: I’m game.

Teacher: How many Sons are there according to the Course?

Student: The Course tells us there is only one Son.

Teacher: And how many parts are there participating in this one Son?

Student: Billions here on earth alone. If we count all of them in the universe it would be beyond that which we can count.

Teacher: Did all the parts of the Son separate or just part of them?

Student: We learned earlier that part of them separated and part stayed home as related in the parable of the Prodigal Son and Helen’s writings. (See Part 8)

Teacher: And when the Course is talking about things that apply to the Sonship, or the Son, is it talking about an individual part or the whole Sonship?

Student: I would say it would be the whole Sonship unless indicated to be otherwise.

Teacher: And would the decisions of the Sonship be governed by the whole Sonship or just those who are awake and not separated in dreams?

Student: That is a very interesting question I have not seen asked before. That is a difficult one.

Teacher: Tell me this. If you have a business partner and he is asleep and you cannot wake him, can he participate in the enterprise?

Student: I suppose not.

Teacher: Then how about the Sonship which is asleep – like you are me? Are we even aware of what the Sonship is doing?

Student: I’d like to be, but I have no awareness of it.

Teacher: So, when the Course speaks to those who are asleep (you and me) about the Sonship which is fully awake and in heaven what must it really be saying?

Student: You’ve guided me to something which should have been obvious, but I had never before considered. There has always been a large number of the Sonship who have either returned to heaven or never left. These would be fully awake.

Teacher: And for these parts of the Sonship who are as one and fully awake, would it be as if the separation never happened?

Student: I suppose it would. That would explain the “never happened” comments of the Course which seem to disagree with others indicating something did happen.

Teacher: The Course speaks of those who have maintained the unity of the Son:

“The Son of God, who sleepeth not, has kept faith with his Father for you.” T-13.I.7

This tells us that there has always been united Sons who did, not or are not sleeping, supporting the Oneness.

Then there is this:

“The Kingdom of Heaven is the dwelling place of the Son of God, who left not his Father and dwells not apart from Him.” T-18.VI.1

What does this tell us?

Student: Here it seems to be talking about the whole and not the part. It seems to be saying that the Son as a whole has always had many parts that are awake and thus the Son has never left the Father.

Teacher: Would that be true even if parts did fall sleep and not participate?

Student: I’ve never thought of it that way before, but it would seem so.

Teacher: We use this same type of wording for things we do on earth. Let us suppose you placed an order for 1000 widgets from the AAA Manufacturing company with two shifts – one in the day and the other at night. In reality your order was put together by the day shift while the night shift was inactive and slept. When someone asks you who made the widgets do you explain that it was the day shift or just say it was AAA Manufacturing?

Student: It would be silly to break it down. I’d just say AAA Manufacturing.

Teacher: Would it be correct to say that AAA Manufacturing never sleeps or never ceases to do their job even though half of the are not at the job at any given moment?

Student: I think I see where you are going with this. Even though part of the Sonship is “traveling in dreams” part is still awake fulfilling the function of the united Son.

Teacher: Does this then solve your dilemma over the seeming contradiction in the  Course at one time talking as if nothing has happened to the Sonship, but other times as if something did happen?

Student: I suppose it is like AAA Manufacturing. Nothing happened to interfere with their life and purpose, but at the same time there were those were asleep who would soon need to wake up and do their job.

Teacher: Yes. Each person in the company has a part, and is needed, and the time will come that those who are sleeping in this world will need to wake up as indicated here.

“God’s extending outward, though not His completeness, is blocked when the Sonship does not communicate with Him as one. So He thought, ‘My children sleep and must be awakened.’” T-6.V.1

Student: Interesting. I guess God needs us back at our posts and we are approaching the time we must wake up.

Teacher: Indeed. We cannot play around in dreamland forever.

Links to The Mysteries of A Course in Miracles:

Read the Introduction HERE, Read Chapter One HERE. Chapter Two HERE, Chapter Three HERE, Chapter Four HERE, Chapter Five HERE Chapter Six HERE, Chapter Seven HERE, Chapter Eight HERE, Chapter Nine HERE, Chapter Ten HERE, Chapter Eleven HERE, Chapter Twelve HERE, Chapter Thirteen HERE, Chapter Fourteen HERE, Fifteen HERE, Sixteen HERE, Seventeen HERE,       Eighteen HERE, Nineteen HERE, Twenty HERE, Twenty-One HERE, Twenty-Two HERE, Twenty-Three HERE, Twenty-Four HERE, Twenty-Five HERE, Twenty-Six HERE, Chapter Twenty-Seven  HERE, Chapter Twenty-Eight  HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7, Part 8, Part 9

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

 

ACIM Conversations, Part 9

ACIM Conversations, Part 9
Are We Watching a Movie?

Student: Perhaps the strangest teaching where there is not agreement is this. Some say that we are not even in the dream any more, that it was over long ago, and we are just recalling or observing this life like we do a movie here. It just seems like we are here because we are very involved in the movie.

Teacher: Yes, I have heard that idea before. There are two things you want to do when you hear a supposed teaching from the Course that seems odd.  The first is to make sure you understand it as is actually taught in the Course and, secondly, ask yourself if the teaching makes any sense, especially in relation to the other teachings.

Student: I’m not sure if I understand the Course correctly on this as sometimes it sounds like the separation is over and I’m in heaven just recalling it and other times it tells me I’m dreaming right now in need of salvation and need to awaken.

Teacher: We’ll get to that but first let us use our right-thinking minds and look at this doctrine. Am I right that the belief is that the separation was over long ago and we are really in heaven fully awake?

Student: Yes.

Teacher: And instead of being in the dream they say we are really in heaven reviewing old memories?

Student: Yes, they say it is comparable to us watching a film. Everything in the movie has already happened and we are just kind of watching it and identifying with the old memories and characters. Even this conversation would be in the movie and there is nothing you can do to change what you will say next.

Teacher: Sounds like I do not have free will then.

Student: It would seem that way.

Teacher: The Course definitely tells us we do have free will so that has to be considered.

Student: They say we just have the illusion of free will.

Teacher: I see. The problem with the film analogy is that it doesn’t correspond correctly.

Student: How’s that?

Teacher: When you watch a guy being tortured or being shot in a movie do you actually feel his pain?

Student: Not really.

Teacher: If you really felt the pain inflicted in some of these movies would you pay to attend?

Student: I’d go out of my way to avoid them.

Teacher: You mean you wouldn’t go to see the movie even if it was free?

Student: Not really

Teacher: How about your current life? Have you had painful experiences?

Student: Yes, I had one accident that gave me a lot of pain for over a year.

Teacher: Would you volunteer to relive it as if it were real so you feel the pain again?

Student: I’d have to be crazy to do such a thing.

Teacher: Yet that is what some are saying we are doing. There we were in heaven enjoying peace, love and bliss and all of a sudden, we get the idea to relive all the pain of our earth lives over again. Can you imagine that you would have decided to do that?

Student: Doesn’t make sense.

Teacher: The Course calls this dream experience a nightmare a couple dozen times. Would you of your own free will ask to relive nightmares that last for many lifetimes reaching millions of years?

Student: You’d have to ne beyond crazy to do that.

Teacher: So, after you healed up from your accident did you have any desire to relive the pain as if you were going through it again?

Student: Heaven’s no. I was glad to have that in the past and just wanted to move on to new more enjoyable things

Teacher: It appears that neither you or I can think of any reason that we would want to relive nightmares. In fact, the Course tells us that when the veil is lifted and we awaken that “Nothing that you remember now will you remember.” T-19.IV.D.6 How could we relive this life if we have moved on and it is not even in our memory in heaven, kind of like our dreams fade from our memory after we wake up?

Student: You know… I don’t think that the believers in this idea have thought tis through. The more we examine this the more insane it seems.

Teacher: Yes, the Course calls this separation insane. If life in the dream state is really insane from heaven’s view it would be double insanity to decide to relive it and make it real.

Student: It certainly seems that way, but some of the wording in the Course seems contradictory.

Teacher: Do you have any examples?

Student: I have been studying this and have come up with some like this one:

“This world was over long ago. The thoughts that made it are no longer in the mind that thought of them and loved them for a little while. The miracle but shows the past is gone, and what has truly gone has no effects.” T-28.I.1

Then it talks about “that one instant still called back, as if it could be made again in time. You keep an ancient memory before your eyes.” T-26.V.5

This does make it sound like we have kept the memory of this world, contrary to the verse you just quoted about there being no memory in heaven and there is no problem of separation to deal with.

Teacher: Yet there are many passages that deal with this problem that isn’t supposed to exist such as:

Just as the separation occurred over millions of years, the Last Judgment will extend over a similarly long period, and perhaps an even longer one T-2.VIII.2

Doesn’t that sound like we are in the middle of the problem rather than fully in heaven with no problem?

Student: Seems that way.

Teacher: And doesn’t this world with its pain as well as enjoyments seem real to you and me as well as billions of others.

Student: Indeed.

Teacher: Is something causing this to be happening or nothing?

Student: Of course, it has to be something.

Teacher: And what would that be?

Student: I suppose it is our thoughts.

Teacher: Yes – the Course says this:

“The separation is a system of thought real enough in time, though not in eternity” T-3.VII.3

 Would you say that we are in time?

Student: Seems that way

Teacher: And we should not discount this experience in time as not happening for it is written:

“It is a mistake to believe that a thought system based on lies is weak. Nothing made by a child of God is without power. It is essential to realize this, because otherwise you will be unable to escape from the prison you have made.” T-3.VII.1

Thus, what has happened is that we have made an illusion which is a prison from which we must escape. Does that sound like a different take than that you are fully in heaven with the separation behind you?

Where do you think you are now – on earth or in heaven?

Student: I certainly seem to be on earth. I can feel pain if I pinch myself.

Teacher: A lot of this confusion comes from how the Course defines its terms and applies them. We shall discuss this in greater depth later.

Links to The Mysteries of A Course in Miracles:

Read the Introduction HERE, Read Chapter One HERE. Chapter Two HERE, Chapter Three HERE, Chapter Four HERE, Chapter Five HERE Chapter Six HERE, Chapter Seven HERE, Chapter Eight HERE, Chapter Nine HERE, Chapter Ten HERE, Chapter Eleven HERE, Chapter Twelve HERE, Chapter Thirteen HERE, Chapter Fourteen HERE, Fifteen HERE, Sixteen HERE, Seventeen HERE,       Eighteen HERE, Nineteen HERE, Twenty HERE, Twenty-One HERE, Twenty-Two HERE, Twenty-Three HERE, Twenty-Four HERE, Twenty-Five HERE, Twenty-Six HERE, Chapter Twenty-Seven  HERE, Chapter Twenty-Eight  HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7, Part 8

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 8

ACIM Conversations, Part 8
Is there Son One or Many?

Student: Another point of disagreement is over what the Son is. Some say the Son is completely non dual in the idea that He is one life with no parts.  The other side agrees He is one life but that you, I and all others are parts like cells in our body and are a part of the whole.

Teacher: Let us first look at the implications if we go with the idea that the Son is one life with no parts. How do they explain that there are billions of us Sons right here on planet Earth?

Student: A guy I was communicating with said that I am dreaming you and all the others. When I wake up there will just be me and all others will be no more, like when you dream and wake up and all the people you dreamed about are just gone.

Teacher: When you dreamed about that nice lady a while back and then woke up, who was the one who still existed in our world. You or the lady?

Student: It was me. It was such a nice dream that I was disappointed that she was no longer there.

Teacher: And when you wake up from this earthly dream which one will be the true self or Son – you or me?

Student: Haha. I think I see where you are going. I would hope it would be me as I want to continue to exist

Teacher: How about the guy you were talking with about this? Do you suppose he thinks he will be the one who continues existence?

Student: I would suppose he does.

Teacher: Now think of it for a moment. If this greater dream is an exact correlation to our night dreams, then there is only one entity that is real and the rest will literally disappear on waking. So, the question is – which one of the seven billion people on the planet is the real dreamer?

Student: Good question. I’m sure each ACIM student thinks it is him or herself.

Teacher: Does anyone give a reference from the Course to back up this idea?

Student: Yes. Here is the quote: “What is the same can not be different, and what is one can not have separate parts.” T-25.I.7

They say that the Son is one and therefore cannot have separate parts.

Teacher: Notice that the text says “separate parts” instead of parts. We seem to appear as separated parts in this dream state but the Course says that in the true reality this is not the case. The Son is a unity but does have parts, but they are united parts. Here read this:

Student: “It should especially be noted that God has only one son. If all His creations are His Sons, every one must be an integral part of the whole Sonship. The Sonship in its Oneness transcends the sum of its parts. However, this is obscured as long as any of its parts is missing. That is why the conflict cannot ultimately be resolved until all the parts of the Sonship have returned.” T-2.VII.6

Teacher: Did you notice that “parts of the Sonship” are mentioned?

Student: Yes. It looks like this passage should resolve the dispute. It tells us that God has one Son but mentions parts of the Sonship several times.

Teacher: Also, did you notice that even though it tells us God has one Son that it speaks of Sons plural in the next sentence?

Student: Yes. Interesting.

Teacher: Take a guess as to how many times the Course speaks of Sons plural rather than Son singular?

Student: Not sure. I do remember reading it written as Sons a number of times. I’d say at least a couple dozen.

Teacher: It is written “Sons” 286 times.

Student: Wow! You could explain away a couple instances as some transcribing or editing error, but not 286 times.  The author is definitely telling us that there is more than one part.

Teacher: Do you remember the parable of the Prodigal son?

Student: Yes. The Course references it so it must represent a teaching that Jesus really gave his disciples.

Teacher: How many sons in the story?

Student: Two. One stayed home with the father and the other went into the world.

Teacher: Which one represented us in the dream?

Student: That would be the one who left the Father.

Teacher: And who is represented by the Son who stayed home?

Student: I do not know. Never thought about it. Are you going to tell me that not all the Sons left heaven?

Teacher: I don’t have to. Read this from the original text of the Course:

Student: “The Atonement actually began long before the Crucifixion. Many Souls offered their efforts on behalf of the Separated Ones but they could not withstand the strength of the attack, and had to be brought back. Angels came, too, but their protection was not enough, because the Separated ones were not interested in peace. They had already split themselves, and were bent on dividing rather than reintegrating.” UR T 2 B 43

Teacher: There are two groups of Sons mentioned here. Which group corresponds to the Prodigal Son?

Student: This is interesting. Not sure that I noticed this before. Obviously, it would be the “Separated ones” who are the prodigal.

Teacher: And who corresponds to the Son who stayed with the Father?

Student: It says “Souls offered their efforts on behalf of the Separated Ones but they could not withstand the strength of the attack, and had to be brought back.” They must be Sons who never left the Father as mentioned in the parable.

Teacher: We have here two major parts to the Sonship. Those who stayed in heaven, and those who separated and came to this world of illusion. But notice that both groups are written as plural here.

Student: Yes. I see that. It speaks of “Souls” plural concerning those who never left and “Separated ones” for those who left.

Teacher: Is there any way this account could be true if the Sonship were one with no parts?

Student: Can’t think of any. I’m surprised there is so much division on this teaching.

Teacher: So, how would you sum up the true concept of the Sonship based on what the Course actually says?

Student: There is one Son but in the eternal realm and all the parts are united as one life, even the eternal parts of the sleeping Son.

Teacher: The Course clarifies this saying that “God has but one son, knowing them all as One.” T-9.VI.3 “them all” obviously refers to the parts.

Student: This discussion has caused something significant to dawn on me.

Teacher: And that would be…?

Student: A lot of students believe there is just one Son with no parts that is awake in heaven now because of numerous references to us being the one Son or the only Son. It is true that even though we are separated and, in the dream, we are still identified with the one Son who is still awake and in heaven. But what is overlooked is that not all the Sons left heaven. There has always been many Sons who never left who  are fully awake and the eternal part of ourselves are still one with them.

Teacher: Good thinking. Now on this subject we have one more point to clarify. Remember how we corresponded our night dreams to our dream here and they didn’t seem to match? What was the difference?

Student: When I wake up from a night dream all the characters are gone and there is just me left. When the Son sleeps many real parts are involved.

Teacher: And what has to wake up for all the characters to disappear?

Student: I’m nor sure. We know that Jesus woke up but we are still here.

Teacher: So to correspond to waking up in the morning apparently more than one part has to awaken. What has to   awaken to make the whole dream disappear?

Student: Okay, I think I get it. The Sonship is one but with many parts so the whole Sonship must awaken. Having a few parts awake would be like me in the morning being still asleep but being slightly aware that it is time to wake up.

Teacher: Exactly, and the Course agrees with you. “Together is your joint inheritance remembered and accepted by you both. Alone it is denied to both of you. … you may not fully understand as yet that you could never be released alone.” T-31.II.11

So does our awakening fully happen alone or with others?

Student: So, according to this I just cannot awaken alone, enter heaven and then you disappear. You must awaken with me.

Teacher: This next passage clarifies this. Go ahead and read it:

Student: “It should especially be noted that God has only one Son. If all His creations are His Sons, every one must be an integral part of the whole Sonship. The Sonship in its Oneness transcends the sum of its parts. However, this is obscured as long as any of its parts is missing. That is why the conflict cannot ultimately be resolved until ALL THE PARTS OF THE SONSHIP HAVE RETURNED. Only then can the meaning of wholeness in the true sense be understood.” T-2.VII.6

Teacher: How many parts of the Sonship must awaken and return before the separation is healed?

Student: All of them.

Teacher: Would you say that all the parts awakening corresponds to you waking up in the morning no longer dreaming.

Student: That sounds right. But what about you, me and others?  Do they disappear?

Teacher: Their egos disappear but the real part remains. You and I will be there as united parts sharing in the mind and life of the one Sonship.

Student: I’m glad to have this settled in harmony with the Course. This talk of me or others disappearing into nothingness sounded creepy and just wrong.

Teacher: Yes, the real truth always brings peace and a sense of joyousness.

Links to The Mysteries of A Course in Miracles:

Read the Introduction HERE, Read Chapter One HERE. Chapter Two HERE, Chapter Three HERE, Chapter Four HERE, Chapter Five HERE Chapter Six HERE, Chapter Seven HERE, Chapter Eight HERE, Chapter Nine HERE, Chapter Ten HERE, Chapter Eleven HERE, Chapter Twelve HERE, Chapter Thirteen HERE, Chapter Fourteen HERE, Fifteen HERE, Sixteen HERE, Seventeen HERE,       Eighteen HERE, Nineteen HERE, Twenty HERE, Twenty-One HERE, Twenty-Two HERE, Twenty-Three HERE, Twenty-Four HERE, Twenty-Five HERE, Twenty-Six HERE, Chapter Twenty-Seven  HERE, Chapter Twenty-Eight  HERE

ACIM Conversations, Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6, Part 7

Copyright by J J Dewey

Index for Original Archives

Index for Recent Posts

Easy Access to All the Writings

For Free Book go HERE and other books HERE

JJ’s Amazon page HERE