2002-3-27 03:19:00
John Z writes:
Injustice?? In the parable, the wife comes back in a subsequent life and kills the man that previously killed her. How does that bring "justice" to the woman? Intuitively "justice" is making the victim "whole". If I steal $50 from you, justice requires that I make you "whole". At the very least, that would require paying back the $50. Perhaps something more for mental/emotional pain and suffering you experienced. The problem with such examples is that most "injustices" in life are NOT SO SIMPLE. You can't reach into your pocketbook and write a check to "fix" them. How indeed, can someone who destroys my reputation "make me whole?" How indeed, can someone who commits adultery and destroys my family, "make me whole?" By letting me destroy HIS reputation in a future incarnation? Hardly. By letting me commit adultery with HIS wife in a future incarnation. Absurd. Some come back and try to say that such karmic "cause and effect" is needed because it is a "TEACHING TOOL". My response was: "What? There is no other way to learn?" The reply: "There is, but karma is the best way." That kind of a weak response leaves me cold. That is a poor and flimsy foundation to build what seems to be "core concepts" [karma and reincarnation].
At the end of the day, it is my opinion that concepts like karma and reincarnation need to be revisited, along with a SERIOUS discussion about "justice". I realize that saying this is the equivalent of blasphemy in this group, but issues are there. AND, they have not been adequately and openly dealt with
I believe that progression DOES involve many steps [e.g. grades in school]. I believe one must "pass" one grade before going on to the next. That makes sense. John Z.
JJ
I don't know if it is possible to commit blasphemy with this group John. You'd have to be pretty outrageous.
You say you believe in learning by steps and grades. This cannot be done without the principle behind karma which is cause and effect. The story of the progression of the entity under discussion is a story of moving from step to step and grade to grade just as you say you believe. One cannot have the effect of learning unless there is a cause that stimulates the learning. You cannot cite an exception to this.
Some are trying to interpret karma from a narrow viewpoint here, but to understand it we must realize that a countless numbers of variables are always involved.
If we had a black and white attitude toward cause and effect of mixing colors then when we mix yellow and blue would not have green, but something that is part yellow and part blue. This of course is not the case.
When we mix equal portions of yellow and blue then we get solid green. When we look at the green we may say that it does not seem to represent the cause since yellow and blue do not look like green.
In addition to this we can mix differing amounts of yellow and blue and obtain a million shades of green. The interesting thing is that in the end, even though there are many differing results, each result (karma) is exactly equal to the results of a formula.
In the example of the story the wife did not have to kill her husband to fulfill the demands of karma and justice. If she had not killed him then someone else would have and she would not have added a negative cause (karma) to her history.
She killed him because she carried over a grievance from the abuse she suffered from the past. Because she did not forgive she then transmuted that grievance into the action of killing her husband in a future life.
Thus her lack of forgiveness for her own murder turned her into a murderer in a future time.
The children were too innocent to carry over a grievance and thus remained innocent in the future life.
Justice was brought to the woman because she saw the results of her lack of forgiveness. This is one reason why forgiveness is so important for it can set up a cause that will make us become that which we do not forgive in others.
John asks:
"How indeed, can someone who destroys my reputation "make me whole?" How indeed, can someone who commits adultery and destroys my family, "make me whole?" By letting me destroy HIS reputation in a future incarnation?"
It is not up to any other person to make you whole. Only you can do that. If someone destroys your reputation you become whole through forgiving him. When you forgive him this releases you from coming back in a future time and adding additional karma to yourself by attempting to take your suppressed wrath out on him by destroying his reputation.
If you do forgive him the man will not escape karma, for a magnetic force will be created that will draw someone else forward to teach the man the needed lesson.
If you are thinking of wholeness a purely physical level one must realize that if your reputation is destroyed it is because of a cause you set up either earlier in this life or a previous life. Even so if one learns the principle of forgiveness his attitude will be such that no circumstances will have power to take away his peace.
I have issued the following challenge several times and so far no one has been able to fill it.
Show me one example where the law of cause and effect (karma) is neutralized. In other words, show me one cause with no effect or one effect that does not have a cause.
There is none.
Copyright 2002 by J.J. Dewey, All Rights Reserved